Cam or supercharger for a few extra HP?

[mlgreen]

Originally Posted by JANNETTYRACING

On an L99 you much better off just add a Supercharger Everyone can drive it and it adds the most power per dollar.

You can have 505 RWHP on a otherwise stock L99.

So on an L99 if you throw on a supercharger you don't have to replace the failure prone lifters or anything? Just install, tune, and go?

[dshep214]

The difference with my Ls3 with the LT and the cam was like night and day. Im running stock clutch no problem almost added 100 hp total. Well worth it

[calbert1999]

You'll notice a huge different with a good CAM and some headers. No matter what anyone says, supercharging without upgrading bottom end is risky. Some people are lucky, others drive like grannys so engine lasts, others aren't lucky or drive the vehicle the way it should be driven and engine blows up within days or months.
Based on your budget I'd go with CAM, and then if / when you have the $ do a proper engine upgrade and supercharger build.

[geaux_tigerss]

Cams sound awesome and offer (usually) safer** performance, but if this car is a daily driver, you need to find a test drive a cammed car first. When you move the power band around with a cam, it can drastically affect drivability. Since you have the LS3, you won't need to worry about a stall converter, but a big lopey cam that surges at low rpms can really make stop and go driving a headache.

The other benefit to a supercharger is the area under the curve. Take a look at some torque curves for cams vs those for FI (even more pronounced with positive displacement types). You can get full torque at 2k rpms with a maggie or similar blower.

**(Speculation ahead!!) This may be due to the fact that cams often make lower peak gains than forced induction. Show me someone that has a 550+ rwhp car with nothing but a cam and bolt ons and I would imagine that it is no more or less reliable than an otherwise similar FI car.

[JANNETTYRACING]

Originally Posted by mlgreen

So on an L99 if you throw on a supercharger you don't have to replace the failure prone lifters or anything? Just install, tune, and go?

The Failures are Real, REAL RARE that is, mostly from over reving the engine when a tuner sets the Rev limiter too high.

The supercharger does not put any more stress on the lifters that a completely stock engine does and we have sucessfully supercharged 100s of L99s without Issue.

It still amazes me how 1 failure out of 10,000 makes them all bad.

The internet is good and evil at the same time.

Ted.

[camslambam]

The lifters fail due to rpm... Thus why a big cam would require you to change lifters.

But strapping on a supercharge only won't do a damn thing to your lifters. Give Ted a call at jannetty racing. The guy literally has the best s/c deals and best tunes around.

[IPT]

This interesting to me as I weight the question myself. I like the sound of a cammed car, but it seems like a SC gives more power and requires less tear down of the motor (so if I wanted to return it to stock to sell i could). I see a bunch of shops offer forged bottom ends with a cam and SC build.

At what point is the bottom end at risk? Have there been failures of the LS3 motors with just a SC and headers? I personally am leaning toward a SC but I really like the idea of adding a cam for that awesome sound (maybe a SC and mild blower freindly cam too). Still in research mode myself. Thanks for any thoughts!

[Run4two]

I love this thread! I've been debating the same thing! I'll have close to 10,000 saved up by the fall and plan on doing upgrades. All I have is a CAI w/ scoop and relocate. I'll probably buy a VMax TB soon, but am looking to do something more. I know I need exhaust work. Don't know weather that will be LT headers or what. Then there's the big question Cam or SC? Do I really need an LS3 conversion on my L99? I'm no raceboy, but I do like my giddyup and go!

[WheelmanSS]

Too many people are afraid of superchargers over misconceptions and nonsense. They are more than capable of producing long term power safely.

Can you have something go wrong with a supercharger? Sure. Bad tune, not enough fuel, etc.

Can you have something go wrong with a cam? Sure. Bad install, faulty valvetrain parts, etc.

If $3k is your budget, however, that is not FI territory. A cam and valvetrain option is more realistic.

[IPT]

Seems to me the only downsides of the SC is the cost, and the lack of that wicked sounding loped exhaust.

[mikeSS]

Originally Posted by IPT

Seems to me the only downsides of the SC is the cost, and the lack of that wicked sounding loped exhaust.

a new s/c installed tuned, cost like the price of a Ls3 engine. so yes they are costly.

[Snidely Whiplash]

Originally Posted by JANNETTYRACING

On an L99 you much better off just add a Supercharger Everyone can drive it and it adds the most power per dollar.

You can have 505 RWHP on a otherwise stock L99.

I concur with the pro's advice. With a cam of decent gains, you're gonna need a stall converter. Then there's the issue of 3.23 rear gears being a little high.
Supercharger will save you money and grief in the long run.

Keep in mind, the street LS3 & L99 huffers are underdriven to compensate for pump gas and do not force as much air into the motor as the lower compression LSA motor. If you RRALLY want to have fun with the huffer, get a matching camshaft installed. Then again, the pro might recommend stronger driveline parts.

The LS3 motor can greatly benefit from a CAI, cam and header package. You have the benefit of a manual tranny w/a 3.01 first gear along with 3.45 rear gears. You will only have to adjust your driving style a little to enjoy the benefits (unless you want a big cam) which becomes tiresome in daily driving traffic.

My experience with motors is old school dating back to the late 60s. We had the benefit of some master head machinists in DFW and all you had to do was buy their cam to go with your ported heads and matched intake. I personally ran a Holley "650" 2 barrel carb. The street was about poker faces. The carb was modified to flow 690 cfm. The car lost 10 lb/ft of torque with more flow. The roller cammed, 12.5:1, 355" motor with ported "double hump" factory iron heads put 587 to the wheels with a 2 barrel carb (thanks to Kim Barr). It paid for itself MANY times over.

12.5:1 on the street? Sure! Factory L88s and ZL1s had it. Fill the tank with Sunoco 260 or the Premium Shell gas (102 octane) and you were good to go. A big cam would also ease some of that octane requirement.

[Snidely Whiplash]

Originally Posted by IPT

Seems to me the only downsides of the SC is the cost, and the lack of that wicked sounding loped exhaust.

That's the cam lope. The exhaust note is the one wanted by the owner. I like the quiet note of the Corsa Touring cat-back system. Walk softly until you put your foot into it.

[Snidely Whiplash]

Originally Posted by Run4two

I love this thread! I've been debating the same thing! I'll have close to 10,000 saved up by the fall and plan on doing upgrades. All I have is a CAI w/ scoop and relocate. I'll probably buy a VMax TB soon, but am looking to do something more. I know I need exhaust work. Don't know weather that will be LT headers or what. Then there's the big question Cam or SC? Do I really need an LS3 conversion on my L99? I'm no raceboy, but I do like my giddyup and go!

If you're in Cali, I'd go with a huffer. They most likely have CARB certification for 50 states. You go installing headers, cam, etc, and you will have problems in Cali.

I knew guys that built cars years ago when Cali first started cracking down on emissions. They bought an alcohol carb and already had huge fuel pumps and lines to accommodate alcohol. I believe it takes 3 times the amount of alcohol to make a horsepower a gasoline. My buds would spend the day changing the carb, strapping the 5 gallon tank of alcohol in the trunk, and go get their alcohol "exemption" as alky is clean burning and exempt from emissions testing. It didn't help them when Cali starting using "sniffers" during roadside checks.

That's why my Chevy II was such a blast. No emissions check required. I put VP C-12 in the 12 gallon main fuel cell and VP C-16 in the 2.5 gallon cell for playing with the bottle on. I simply switched fuel pumps and was ready for action. Texas still does not check older cars for leaded fuel.