Why are Camaros all over ebay for under invoice and challengers are at msrp?

[AZ MSCL]

Originally Posted by anthonybyram

:troll:I smell a TROLL!

Paranoia will destroya...

[coolman]

Originally Posted by rham48

I guess it's a regional thing. Plus most people in this town (Scottsdale and Paradise Valley) have more money than they know what to do with (except me and a few neighbors), it's where all the sports figures, doctors and lawyers live. The reality is BMWs, Mercedes, Lexus and a few Lambos, Ferraris and Bentleys are as common as Mustangs. I know for a fact that a doctor bought his Challenger SRT after seeing mine (his daughter told me). He also has a Range Rover and a Mercedes. Classic one-ups-manship. With the exception of a few real muscle car lovers, it's all about a display of wealth here.

Sorry, rambling now...

In that case I wouldn't use your area to judge how something is selling in the rest of the country because lambos, and ferraris aren't the norm in most of the country. And I would say that if you live with the sports figures, doctors, and lawyers then your not hurting either. A new mustang and a new challenger. So, In that type of area I can see everything being higher because people are willing to pay for it. I don't understand your argument about why chrysler isn't building more of these cars. Just to keep the price up? That doesn't make sense with a car like the challenger. I can see it with the viper that was never intended as a car for the masses ,but not the challenger. They know their not selling well, so their not building many. IF they were selling they would be building them hand over fist just like GM with the camaro. Supply and demand would have the price up on it's own if they where selling. Just look at the camaro selling at sometimes 10grand over msrp now their selling for msrp or sometimes less.

[priz23]

I agree with everyone that there are fewer Challengers out there, and its due to a few factors. The biggest is chyrsler/dodge is producing less of them to size up against demand. I think most people are a lot more nervous on chrysler's viability in the future vs GM, which surely hurts demand. Also, due to their shaky standing, they had stopped production on ALL vehicles for an extended period of time this year. While GM had longer shut downs than normal, the Camaro factory kept on humming along. I think price impacts the sales too. The camaro is a little cheaper compared to a similar challenger, and its generally perceived that you get more performance from the camaro for the same dollar. Finally, the Camaro is the best car ever, of course it will sell more (okay, pure opinon, but this is a camaro site).

Now to rham's point, we might get more camaros on the road than mustangs in the near future, but is that what you all really want? I like being the only guy in town that has one in his driveway. Not as cool if there are 10 running around. Its such a great car though that it might be only a matter of time before you see camaros all over just like mustangs.

Rham keep the weather nice for me, I take off for Phoenix in 17 hours, will be on the golf course by 2 tommorow, and watch my sundevils beat down the scumcats on Saturday.

[rallyyellow]

*puts on flame retardant suit*























it's because Mustangs are better cars.






















jk jk

[AmericanCamaro]

The starting price of ebay does not mean the "selling price". It is actually against franchise rules to sell cars for under invoice. I hope you are not confusing invoice for the window sticker. We stock more Camaros, any day, than the Dodge Challenger store across the street sells in a year. We are one of the largest Chevrolet Dealers in the Mid-West and ship Camaros out every week because of selection and price. americanpatrick@aol.com Please feel free to e-mail me any time if you are ready to buy a Camaro or Corvette. pmccarthy@andymohr.com Thank You, Patrick

[AZ MSCL]

Originally Posted by priz23

I agree with everyone that there are fewer Challengers out there, and its due to a few factors. The biggest is chyrsler/dodge is producing less of them to size up against demand. I think most people are a lot more nervous on chrysler's viability in the future vs GM, which surely hurts demand. Also, due to their shaky standing, they had stopped production on ALL vehicles for an extended period of time this year. While GM had longer shut downs than normal, the Camaro factory kept on humming along. I think price impacts the sales too. The camaro is a little cheaper compared to a similar challenger, and its generally perceived that you get more performance from the camaro for the same dollar. Finally, the Camaro is the best car ever, of course it will sell more (okay, pure opinon, but this is a camaro site).

Now to rham's point, we might get more camaros on the road than mustangs in the near future, but is that what you all really want? I like being the only guy in town that has one in his driveway. Not as cool if there are 10 running around. Its such a great car though that it might be only a matter of time before you see camaros all over just like mustangs.

Rham keep the weather nice for me, I take off for Phoenix in 17 hours, will be on the golf course by 2 tommorow, and watch my sundevils beat down the scumcats on Saturday.

Weather is fantastic! Cool at night but not like IL. What course you playin? Enjoy your stay.

[AZ MSCL]

Originally Posted by coolman

In that case I wouldn't use your area to judge how something is selling in the rest of the country because lambos, and ferraris aren't the norm in most of the country. And I would say that if you live with the sports figures, doctors, and lawyers then your not hurting either. A new mustang and a new challenger. So, In that type of area I can see everything being higher because people are willing to pay for it. I don't understand your argument about why chrysler isn't building more of these cars. Just to keep the price up? That doesn't make sense with a car like the challenger. I can see it with the viper that was never intended as a car for the masses ,but not the challenger. They know their not selling well, so their not building many. IF they were selling they would be building them hand over fist just like GM with the camaro. Supply and demand would have the price up on it's own if they where selling. Just look at the camaro selling at sometimes 10grand over msrp now their selling for msrp or sometimes less.

I'm a retired cop and 48 yrs old. I'm a drawing 100% through the VA and Social Security disability. I'm doing pretty good but I don't make the big bucks like sports figures, doctors, and lawyers - some of us have middle class incomes and I sure as hell don't live with nor anywhere near them. I do have some friends who are wealthy, one lives in a 35,000 sq ft home and their guest house is as big as my home. As for sales of cars, I'm done. Way too much effort for nothing. More Camaros are sold than Challengers.

[Dakota Kid]

Originally Posted by anthonybyram

:troll:I smell a TROLL!

rham48 is not a troll. He contributes to this forum.

[RedJewelrsss32]

Try living in a area were rear wheel drives just dont sell. Local Dodge dealership has had a Challenger for seven months,Chevy dealer has four Camaros on the lot for two months. Prices on these things dont even come down, their priced way above MSRP. Really is affected by location.

[AZ MSCL]

Originally Posted by Dakota Kid

rham48 is not a troll. He contributes to this forum.

Wow. Thanks Dakota Kid, I appreciate that!

[ViperTomcat]

One of the reasons you dont see sales match (and production numbers) match is because the Camaro has its very own plant that allows it to be built at a rate of 9000+ a month.

The Challenger has to share the production lines of the Brampton, Ontario plant with the Charger (all models) and the 300 (all models). It has nothing to do with "popularity" as to why you dont see the sales numbers being the same, it has everything to do with the fact that the factory simply cannot build that many of them.

As an example I have a picture (a hard copy, not on the computer) of my Challenger on the construction line. Right in front of it is a SRT Charger and behind it is a R/T Charger. Behind the Charger is a 300 and then another Challenger. When you factor in the demand for police models and fleet models of the Charger..you find there isnt a whole lot of room for the Challenger to be produced.

This will be even further cut into when the Chrysler 200 and Alfa Romeos start being built.

More production space=more cars=lower individual cost. Its simple supply and demand.


ALSO:

Figure that for the 2008 and 2009 MY you had only around 42,000 Challengers built. 2009 was a short year due to the restructuring and the 2010 production is only about three months old.

[AZ MSCL]

Originally Posted by ViperTomcat

One of the reasons you dont see sales match (and production numbers) match is because the Camaro has its very own plant that allows it to be built at a rate of 9000+ a month.

The Challenger has to share the production lines of the Brampton, Ontario plant with the Charger (all models) and the 300 (all models). It has nothing to do with "popularity" as to why you dont see the sales numbers being the same, it has everything to do with the fact that the factory simply cannot build that many of them.

As an example I have a picture (a hard copy, not on the computer) of my Challenger on the construction line. Right in front of it is a SRT Charger and behind it is a R/T Charger. Behind the Charger is a 300 and then another Challenger. When you factor in the demand for police models and fleet models of the Charger..you find there isnt a whole lot of room for the Challenger to be produced.

This will be even further cut into when the Chrysler 200 and Alfa Romeos start being built.

More production space=more cars=lower individual cost. Its simple supply and demand.


ALSO:

Figure that for the 2008 and 2009 MY you had only around 42,000 Challengers built. 2009 was a short year due to the restructuring and the 2010 production is only about three months old.

Well said ViperTomcat. It seems anytime someone says something even indirectly negative about the Camaro, regardless of how inconsequential, certain people take that as a personal attack on their ride (so much for being a muscle car lover - then again, few have really made that claim, at least publicly). Present them with facts, they go ignored or change the subject. On the other hand, many are reasonable, not threatened by negative comments and understand that all performance cars have issues, but still appreciate them.

As for the constant comments regarding how "under-powered" the Challenger is, well, most seem to rely on what they've read in some car magazine instead of reality. For instance, a stock Camaro SS hovers between 4.4 and 4.9 secs for 0-60 in independent testing using professional and/or experienced track drivers. Obviously, that could be improved with a few mods. I've managed 4.6 in my "under-powered" 2009 auto RT and that's with runs which could have been better (too much tire spin at the launch or at shifting to 2nd - in automatic, not manually shifting). Granted, I have a CAI, catback and a "canned" tune from a DS Predator, which probably gives me about 30-40 more HP - still less than an SS (but probably as much torque). I know of at least one 2010 auto RT owner who's done it in 4.5 secs and he's only got about 1000 miles on his (I have 9000) with similar mods. Of course, none of this counts because it wasn't video taped or documented in three different magazines.

I like this forum and most of the people here because we're talkin' muscle cars and for the exchange of info, but a few get bent too easily. I understand loving your car and friendly rivalry, but some people just don't get "it."

[Jiu Jitsu Jon]

Originally Posted by AmericanCamaro

The starting price of ebay does not mean the "selling price". It is actually against franchise rules to sell cars for under invoice.

Ok, now I'm confused...before we were told GM had no control over what dealers charged and dealers could charge whatever they wanted (granted, not by you.) and now apparently it can't be sold below a certain price?

[Thrillz]

:troll: