[V8Snob]

Learn to drive

[DenverTaco07]

Originally Posted by V8Snob

Learn to drive

lol...that's helpful.

[ctrlz]

Originally Posted by V8Snob

Learn to drive

How about, "Understand the limitations of the technology at your disposal"?

[mjk3888]

To anyone who is considering running an alternate set of All Seasons. A used set of SS wheels with some new All
Seasons (50K/25K warranty) can be had for about 1K even. Thats cheaper
than a set of new GY Supercar 3's for my SS 1LE!

Garage Tire Storage $40
TPMS relearn tool $20
Used wheels $350ish
New All Seasons $650ish

For those wondering, I went with 255/35 & 275/35 General GMAX AS-05 tires.
If you go with used RS wheels for square setup the tread warranty isn't cut in
half on the rear tires.

[Norm Peterson]

Originally Posted by SuperSound

Factory wheels and with this being eastern NC, seriously doubt he had swapped off the stock MPSS'. Those tires are just as bad in the cold as our GYs, and more expensive.

In my experience, MPSS has been proving to be one of the more capable summer tires at low temperatures - as long as the pavement is bare and dry. I'm talking temperatures down into the low 20°'s F and even teens here.

That changes drastically as soon as you add any snow or slush underfoot to the cooler temperatures, especially as far as braking is concerned. Almost like being on wet ice. Holy split-personality, Batman.


Norm

[franksredhot]

It doesn't make sense to me to buy rims and all-season tires just for the winter. All seasons are a compromise for use year round and not going to make the car great in snow and ice. If you're that worried about the summer tires, then buy a set of winter tires and rims. I still think our stock run-flats aren't that bad in the winter. I don't even think the all seasons will outperform the run flats in 30 degrees if the road is dry. Also, the tires do warm up while you're driving, so they're worst when you first get on the road.

[ctrlz]

Originally Posted by franksredhot

I still think our stock run-flats aren't that bad in the winter. I don't even think the all seasons will outperform the run flats in 30 degrees if the road is dry. Also, the tires do warm up while you're driving, so they're worse when you first get on the road.

I drove on run-flats last winter. Now have General all seasons this winter.
My experience:
No question run flats slip when cold. Bad in the 30's. Dangerous in the 20's. Yes they do warm with driving, but danger factor not worth it to me.
All-seasons easily out perform the run flats in the 30's and the 20's aren't even worth talking about, because the run-flats slip. I was driving in 6 degree weather a few weeks ago, something I would not have attempted last winter with the run-flats.
I think it may be easier to sense the tire slip on a manual transmission. I know I could tell it was slipping in the parking lot when leaving work last winter. That was my wake up call. Coming out of the garage in the morning was fine, but once they sat in the cold all day those tires would slip.
I really don't think it is appropriate to be driving a dangerous car for 5 minutes until my tires warm up. Last winter I drove a different car to work once I figured out what was going on. Never had a car with summer tires before!

[Norm Peterson]

Originally Posted by franksredhot

It doesn't make sense to me to buy rims and all-season tires just for the winter. All seasons are a compromise for use year round and not going to make the car great in snow and ice.

If you live in an area that doesn't get much snow and little or no icing, and where the roads get cleared in a timely manner when it does happen, winter tires are not necessarily the best answer. Winter tires generally wear faster and don't grip as well on bare pavement, so there are a couple of downsides. Tire selection involves compromises and trade-offs. Always.

That said, I get it if snow removal attention to neighborhood streets in anybody's area isn't very good.


Norm

[Norm Peterson]

Originally Posted by ecko04

For members to come here and say that the stock summer rubber, that comes with a warning of being operated in less than 40 degree temperatures being hazardous, give guidance and advice that they’re fine in cold and snow despite the Goodyear warning is downright dangerous.

Why even bother chancing it if you can afford a $600 winter/snow wheel and tire setup? It is just mind boggling.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Keep in mind that the "approximately 40°" warning is Chevy's warning for the specific make & model summer tires that Chevy chose. It's also just a ballpark number rather than a 40.5° = pass / 39.5° = fail sort of situation. Summer tire makes/models other than the ones Chevy chooses (*cough* G:2 Goodyears on the 5th gens *cough*) may well be less sensitive to cooler temperatures.


There are people who wouldn't shop CL or eBay for anything. Let alone for anything as mission-critical as their car's tires.


Norm

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by Norm Peterson

Keep in mind that the "approximately 40°" warning is Chevy's warning for the specific make & model summer tires that Chevy chose. It's also just a ballpark number rather than a 40.5° = pass / 39.5° = fail sort of situation. Summer tire makes/models other than the ones Chevy chooses (*cough* G:2 Goodyears on the 5th gens *cough*) may well be less sensitive to cooler temperatures.


There are people who wouldn't shop CL or eBay for anything. Let alone for anything as mission-critical as their car's tires.


Norm

The warning actually came from Goodyear, passed on by Chevy. And you're right, if I'm reading between the lines, it's as much a safety warning as it is a CYA warning.

[Norm Peterson]

Originally Posted by Mr. Wyndham

The warning actually came from Goodyear, passed on by Chevy. And you're right, if I'm reading between the lines, it's as much a safety warning as it is a CYA warning.

The commonality here may well be Goodyear's consistent choices of summer performance compounding being out of their element at 40-ish F and lower temperatures.

I used to have a set of the original GY Asymmetrics on my GT, and they were specifically listed at Tire Rack as some level of summer performance (very much the reason I chose them in the first place). My cue to swap back to the OE all-seasons was when it got too easy to hang the tail out on dry bare pavement when turning onto a main road from a full stop, which also tended to happen at about that same temperature. That was back when I had a day job; when there was more snow than the OE all-seasons could cope with, I'd take the Maxima instead.

We're getting a little snow as I type this. I may just clear the GT off and go over to the neighborhood pool parking lot for my annual "refresher course" . . . we'll see what transpires.


Norm

[Norm Peterson]

Well, my usual test pad was still bare. But about 100 feet of the street I live on had about 1/2" of snow wet enough to make a snowball with . . . and that's more than MPSS tires can reasonably cope with even in a zero traffic situation. Try starting up from a full stop with the front wheels steered and you'll slide in some direction dictated by road slope or crown, no matter what directions the wheels are pointed in or how gently you ease into clutch engagement. Braking is somewhat better if you can get the tires to dig down to the almost-bare level, but even that's still short of anything you'd call "good".

It's currently 31°F, and on the bare part they're still OK even though it's "wet bare". Trouble is, the streets aren't bare everywhere, so the GT is staying parked in its driveway spot for the time being.


Norm

[dray]

We've had colder than normal (0 to 15 F) in southern Ohio this last week with a couple of 2-3" snows. Have to say I'm amazed at how I got around with my winter tires. The snow/ice drive mode is part of that. It really keeps you from losing control, even it you try. Drove past lots of people with FWD and bad tires that could barely move.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by dray

We've had colder than normal (0 to 15 F) in southern Ohio this last week with a couple of 2-3" snows. Have to say I'm amazed at how I got around with my winter tires. The snow/ice drive mode is part of that. It really keeps you from losing control, even it you try. Drove past lots of people with FWD and bad tires that could barely move.

+1

The traction control systems in the Camaro are top notch. Having a limited slip diff helps, too. With the right tires for the conditions, it's extremely effective!

This is the first year I have put the Sonic through a snowy winter. And although I have winter tires on that as well...the T/C systems are intrusive, and suffocate the car if they activate...at times it's so bad I just turn the whole system off. The car also does not have an LSD, so the tires spin pretty easy...the Camaro's systems never intruded (I felt)...it just prevented loss of control, like it was supposed to.