Headers vs Headers

[8balldeluxe]

I've been reading and researching for several weeks now about headers in general. Generally I'm speaking about comparisons between the highend headers to the more budget friendly headers.

I can't seem to find an accurate up to date independent study done on the comparison of the above said headers, as in performance and reliability thereof.

I know the choices of buying American vs others, and don't want this thread to go that direction, but is there really a big difference in performance from one header to another?

All headers from what I have read use 304 stainless, correct me if I am mislead or wrong. I do know the differences to stainless but is the quality of stainless steel that much better from one set of Headers to another? 304 stainless steel is a grade and it must meet a minimum requirement to be 304 stainless or it's not 304 stainless.

Is the difference in the mandrel bending of the pipe itself that's different? I know that a mandrel bent stainless steel pipe is still a stainless steel pipe. I know the term mandrel, the stretching and compressing of the pipes during the bend to maintain the nominal diameter of the pipes and mandrel bent pipe is better than press bent pipe I could go on...

What the real difference? The inside or how the pipe is welded? The collector?

Is there truly a difference in HP?

I would love to discuss this

[rontammy0]

It's been a hot topic here. Your right 304 stainless is 304 stainless. It's funny how people don't know this. ...alot if times it seems to be fitment that separates the different headers. From what I've read people seem to be picking up on the fact that there are many cheaper headers that members have bought and installed and have been very happy with. So what the difference between $500 headers and $1000 headers? From what I see ...nothing. I'm sure the debate will never end.

[Kodexo]

I've got Texas speed, they sound great, make great power and I had no issues with fitment.

[jcampos]

Originally Posted by Kodexo

I've got Texas speed, they sound great, make great power and I had no issues with fitment.

+1

I don't see what the need is to go and buy $1,100 - $1,400 LT headers like KOOKS or ARH because TSP LT are just as good. I have a friend that has ARH and in all honesty there is nothing about the quality fit and finish that far surpasses TSP. They looked identical.

As far as power... they all produce/allow within the same range of power/flow, given that they are the same measurements i.e. 1 7/8" x 3" or 1 3/4" x 3 or 2" x 3" etc, etc...

Oh btw my friend and I have similar mods, we are within 7 rwhp of each other according to dynos.

[justjoshin]

I have Stainless Power and my buddy has Texas Speed. Both are reasonable priced and we are both very happy with them. Both cars put down good dyno #'s as well.

[Apex Motorsports]

Originally Posted by 8balldeluxe

I've been reading and researching for several weeks now about headers in general. Generally I'm speaking about comparisons between the highend headers to the more budget friendly headers.

I can't seem to find an accurate up to date independent study done on the comparison of the above said headers, as in performance and reliability thereof.

I know the choices of buying American vs others, and don't want this thread to go that direction, but is there really a big difference in performance from one header to another?

All headers from what I have read use 304 stainless, correct me if I am mislead or wrong. I do know the differences to stainless but is the quality of stainless steel that much better from one set of Headers to another? 304 stainless steel is a grade and it must meet a minimum requirement to be 304 stainless or it's not 304 stainless.

Is the difference in the mandrel bending of the pipe itself that's different? I know that a mandrel bent stainless steel pipe is still a stainless steel pipe. I know the term mandrel, the stretching and compressing of the pipes during the bend to maintain the nominal diameter of the pipes and mandrel bent pipe is better than press bent pipe I could go on...

What the real difference? The inside or how the pipe is welded? The collector?

Is there truly a difference in HP?

I would love to discuss this

Not all headers are made of 304 stainless. Many of the low end headers are made of 400 series stainless and some are actually mild steel. If they are really cheap and only come coated it is a safe bet that they are mild steel.

The big differences between the cheap headers and the more expensive ones will be:

a) Fitment. The cheaper stuff often requires some "massaging".

b) Build quality and features. Things like flange thickness, weld quality and reliability, etc.. One thing that almost none of the lower end headers are going to have are merge spikes inside the collector. Those do impact performance but they are not cheap to fabricate. Also the higher end headers usually include gaskets and o2 extensions where the cheap stuff often does not.

c) Where they are made. It costs more to manufacture things here than it does overseas. Whether that is important to you or not it is a factor in the retail price.

d) Warranty. Cheap headers often have little to no warranty where the higher end headers often have limited lifetime warranties.

[8balldeluxe]

This thread is not about what I am looking to purchase but rather the differences in the headers themselves, hence the title.

I am not wanting to compare the "eBay" headers that some seem to run from, more the typical budget friendly headers to the highend stuff

Which headers are made from 400 grade? does anybody know? Post a link of someone can find? Don't send to me.

It seems that the budget friendly to highend stuff as of lately have had no fitment issues.

Do all the highend headers have merge spikes?

From what can be found using the search function it seems that most people have been using the OEM gaskets with headers, O2 extensions don't cost that much.

Build quality looks different and thickness of materials I have found will very from builder to builder.

Warranties are a good thing but I don't plan on keeping my current car and setup for another 50 years and I'll be lucky to live that long.

[pyroguy]

Originally Posted by Apex Motorsports

Not all headers are made of 304 stainless. Many of the low end headers are made of 400 series stainless and some are actually mild steel. If they are really cheap and only come coated it is a safe bet that they are mild steel.

The big differences between the cheap headers and the more expensive ones will be:

a) Fitment. The cheaper stuff often requires some "massaging".

b) Build quality and features. Things like flange thickness, weld quality and reliability, etc.. One thing that almost none of the lower end headers are going to have are merge spikes inside the collector. Those do impact performance but they are not cheap to fabricate. Also the higher end headers usually include gaskets and o2 extensions where the cheap stuff often does not.

c) Where they are made. It costs more to manufacture things here than it does overseas. Whether that is important to you or not it is a factor in the retail price.

d) Warranty. Cheap headers often have little to no warranty where the higher end headers often have limited lifetime warranties.

Couldn't have said it better myself. Apex knows their stuff!

[jcampos]

Originally Posted by 8balldeluxe

This thread is not about what I am looking to purchase but rather the differences in the headers themselves, hence the title.

I am not wanting to compare the "eBay" headers that some seem to run from, more the typical budget friendly headers to the highend stuff

Which headers are made from 400 grade? does anybody know? Post a link of someone can find? Don't send to me.

It seems that the budget friendly to highend stuff as of lately have had no fitment issues.

Do all the highend headers have merge spikes?

From what can be found using the search function it seems that most people have been using the OEM gaskets with headers, O2 extensions don't cost that much.

Build quality looks different and thickness of materials I have found will very from builder to builder.

Warranties are a good thing but I don't plan on keeping my current car and setup for another 50 years and I'll be lucky to live that long.

You have been great info. thus far. If you need more "Google" it or go buy several brands and take a personal consensus on what you prefer.

You're welcome! P.S. APEX knows their stuff!!!

[Apex Motorsports]

Originally Posted by 8balldeluxe

This thread is not about what I am looking to purchase but rather the differences in the headers themselves, hence the title.

I am not wanting to compare the "eBay" headers that some seem to run from, more the typical budget friendly headers to the highend stuff

Which headers are made from 400 grade? does anybody know? Post a link of someone can find? Don't send to me.

It seems that the budget friendly to highend stuff as of lately have had no fitment issues.

Do all the highend headers have merge spikes?

From what can be found using the search function it seems that most people have been using the OEM gaskets with headers, O2 extensions don't cost that much.

Build quality looks different and thickness of materials I have found will very from builder to builder.

Warranties are a good thing but I don't plan on keeping my current car and setup for another 50 years and I'll be lucky to live that long.

We are talking about the same thing. The mid-range products can be pretty hit or miss or we are talking in general. Don't take my comments as trashing mid-range products and trying to sell people on expensive stuff. I don't work on commission and I recommend Stainless Power, the budget line from Stainless Works, A LOT.

Many of them use 409 stainless. They often gloss over it by just saying "stainless steel". SLP, Flowmaster, JBA, Dynatech, etc..

Yes, brands like ARH, Kooks, and Stainless Works all have merge spikes. Stainless Power also has merge spikes.

[Avenging Orange]

Apparently you have not searched enough. This topic has been discussed more than abortion and immigration. Google is your friend. And in the long run....who cares....the majority of known name brand headers will out live your car and all will perform very close to the same.

[ravensjeff]

Nice feedback from Apex. I was wondering a little about the differences as well since I just put AR Headers on; my 1st set ever.

[KaBoom1701]

I'm installing a set of Stainless Works headers soon....

[Apex Motorsports]

Originally Posted by ravensjeff

Nice feedback from Apex. I was wondering a little about the differences as well since I just put AR Headers on; my 1st set ever.

Originally Posted by KaBoom1701

I'm installing a set of Stainless Works headers soon....

Both are really nice top on the line headers.