Torque-To-Yield Bolt Replacements for Alignments.

DeeZ NuttS · 03-11-2018, 06:21 PM

Went to the dealership last week to get an alignment done because I was having abnormal outside wear on my tires and a grown. Make sure if you get an alignment done the mechanic replaces the TTY bolts. My mechanic reused them and the alignment instructions in big red letters says to discard and use new TTY bolts because failure can occur. If you track your car you already know the danger this presents. Here's the review I sent the general manager. I did get a response and he wants to make things right, but I've completely lost trust at this point.

I brought my car in for a noise in the rear. I was told by Jason that the car may need an alignment or rear diff service. The car has 4600 miles and when I asked him multiple times if the alignment or diff service was covered under warranty each time I was met with a no. Feeling like I was being lied to I did my own research with my warranty booklet and read it was covered under warranty. When I mentioned this to him, I hear him ask another adviser over the phone "is alignment covered"?

Also, the mechanic that worked on my vehicle that did the alignment did not replace any of the torque to yield bolts when completing the alignment. This is a serious issue as the instructions specifically state to discard and not reuse TTY bolts as failure of bolts can occur. What happens if I'm on track and I have a failure? This was supposed to be my go to dealership for all my needs but that is no longer the case as the service department is a complete failure in all aspects.

Just a PSA to do research before heading to the dealer to get work done. Its scary to think I'm putting my life in someones hands who doesn't give a sh!t enough to do a job as simple as an alignment correctly and could cost me my life.

seanblurr · 03-11-2018, 06:56 PM

It's good information to know, no doubt. But just an FYI, I adjusted my alignment multiple times last track season and never bothered to change bolts each time. If I do, it will be like a once a year type deal, not every new set up change.

Boost Creep · 03-12-2018, 05:58 AM

Probably didn't have the bolts in stock.

I've seen TTY bolts reused many times and last +100,000 miles, never saw a failure. Doesn't mean it won't happen, but it's not something you see. I don't like the TTY concept as a whole, kind of an engineering example of "book smart, street stupid". It works in theory, but doesn't happen in reality. People are people.

Imagine you're Joe Customer and come in for your $129 alignment and get a bill with $100 worth of TTY bolts added on top. Not happy.

If every shop followed GM's TTY bolt replacement policy for every TTY bolt on every car since TTY's inception, the roads would be paved in discarded TTY bolts.

Good luck finding a shop/dealer doing things "by the book".

motorhead · 03-12-2018, 07:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boost Creep

Probably didn't have the bolts in stock.

I've seen TTY bolts reused many times and last +100,000 miles, never saw a failure. Doesn't mean it won't happen, but it's not something you see. I don't like the TTY concept as a whole, kind of an engineering example of "book smart, street stupid". It works in theory, but doesn't happen in reality. People are people.

Imagine you're Joe Customer and come in for your $129 alignment and get a bill with $100 worth of TTY bolts added on top. Not happy.

If every shop followed GM's TTY bolt replacement policy for every TTY bolt on every car since TTY's inception, the roads would be paved in discarded TTY bolts.

Good luck finding a shop/dealer doing things "by the book".

What you really have to love is the ones that charge you for them ,but dont use them.

Boost Creep · 03-12-2018, 08:45 AM

Gotta earn the name Stealership somehow.

BradfordCamaro · 03-12-2018, 09:14 AM

I has my alignment set at my dealership. They didn't replace the bolts. And that was almost 2 years ago.
My wheels haven't fallen off.
The suspension bolt are also TTY. I think the TTY concept is in part a cover your azz procedure by gm.

thescreensavers · 03-12-2018, 09:58 AM

Check out this thread for more details http://www.camaro6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=502324

In my Experience alignment techs no matter how good, most do not follow OEM torque specs and likely are not "yielding" the bolt.

Also this would explain alignment shifts after track events.

Mountain · 03-12-2018, 10:34 AM

So, as I gather it, yes, TTY bolts should be replaced where *necessary* and able. But here's the thing [that a buddy of mine reminded me of], that I did not think of (and should have from my OEM days). At the plant, it is common for vehicles to undergo minor fixes, to which many times include adjusting parts or installing/updating certain parts that have TTY bolts. Usually, TTY bolts are NOT replaced in these situations...

Should they be? Yes. Do I think you can get away with re-using some bolts? Yes... but, I wouldn't reuse them too much...

Mountain · 03-12-2018, 10:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boost Creep

Probably didn't have the bolts in stock.

I've seen TTY bolts reused many times and last +100,000 miles, never saw a failure. Doesn't mean it won't happen, but it's not something you see. I don't like the TTY concept as a whole, kind of an engineering example of "book smart, street stupid". It works in theory, but doesn't happen in reality. People are people.

Imagine you're Joe Customer and come in for your $129 alignment and get a bill with $100 worth of TTY bolts added on top. Not happy.

If every shop followed GM's TTY bolt replacement policy for every TTY bolt on every car since TTY's inception, the roads would be paved in discarded TTY bolts.

Good luck finding a shop/dealer doing things "by the book".

I agree 100%. Good idea in an engineering sense, but a stupid one in the broad view (customer ownership, serviceability,warranty, etc.). Sadly, usually, the major efforts in product design don't merge into service engineering, which is the area from dealership and beyond. All the focus is on design to delivery and then, PEACE-OUT!

driven2exceSS · 03-12-2018, 10:45 AM

I get the TTY replacements are pretty much a non-issue, but how are we to know when they are or are not being replaced? Just mark them prior just to see? I mean if you do alignments regularly at some point you would like to see them replaced eventually, no? Obviously as the vehicle ages you would see the new hardware, but until?

03-11-2018, 06:21 PM	#1
DeeZ NuttS Drives: 2018 Camaro 2SS 1LE Join Date: Jan 2018 Location: Charlotte, NC Posts: 38	Torque-To-Yield Bolt Replacements for Alignments. Went to the dealership last week to get an alignment done because I was having abnormal outside wear on my tires and a grown. Make sure if you get an alignment done the mechanic replaces the TTY bolts. My mechanic reused them and the alignment instructions in big red letters says to discard and use new TTY bolts because failure can occur. If you track your car you already know the danger this presents. Here's the review I sent the general manager. I did get a response and he wants to make things right, but I've completely lost trust at this point. I brought my car in for a noise in the rear. I was told by Jason that the car may need an alignment or rear diff service. The car has 4600 miles and when I asked him multiple times if the alignment or diff service was covered under warranty each time I was met with a no. Feeling like I was being lied to I did my own research with my warranty booklet and read it was covered under warranty. When I mentioned this to him, I hear him ask another adviser over the phone "is alignment covered"? Also, the mechanic that worked on my vehicle that did the alignment did not replace any of the torque to yield bolts when completing the alignment. This is a serious issue as the instructions specifically state to discard and not reuse TTY bolts as failure of bolts can occur. What happens if I'm on track and I have a failure? This was supposed to be my go to dealership for all my needs but that is no longer the case as the service department is a complete failure in all aspects. Just a PSA to do research before heading to the dealer to get work done. Its scary to think I'm putting my life in someones hands who doesn't give a sh!t enough to do a job as simple as an alignment correctly and could cost me my life.

03-11-2018, 06:56 PM	#2
seanblurr Drives: ZL1 1LE Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: California Posts: 1,297	It's good information to know, no doubt. But just an FYI, I adjusted my alignment multiple times last track season and never bothered to change bolts each time. If I do, it will be like a once a year type deal, not every new set up change. __________________

03-12-2018, 09:14 AM	#6
BradfordCamaro SABIO Drives: 2016 CAMARO 1SS Join Date: Jul 2015 Location: Bradford, ON Posts: 5,012	I has my alignment set at my dealership. They didn't replace the bolts. And that was almost 2 years ago. My wheels haven't fallen off. The suspension bolt are also TTY. I think the TTY concept is in part a cover your azz procedure by gm. __________________

03-12-2018, 10:45 AM	#10
driven2exceSS Drives: 2016 2SS BLK A8 Vert Join Date: Dec 2017 Location: MA Posts: 1,029	I get the TTY replacements are pretty much a non-issue, but how are we to know when they are or are not being replaced? Just mark them prior just to see? I mean if you do alignments regularly at some point you would like to see them replaced eventually, no? Obviously as the vehicle ages you would see the new hardware, but until? __________________ NPP, MRC, Tinted side & rear reflectors, OEM ZL1 Rockers / 3rd Brake / Darken tail lights, OEM Blk rear splash guards, Satin hood wrap, Fuse pull, Sound tube delete, Cat delete, Ported 95 TB, Ported MSD IM, Dry RotoFab, ARH 1 7/8 headers, E85, "Performance Dyno" Tune, BMR "pieces", "Track" alignment, Hawk DCT-70/70's w/SRF, Goodridge lines, Ti shims, Red powdered calipers, 18" APEX SM-10's w/ Pirelli DH's, FE4 Vert swaybars, Brake cooling ducts, ATI 10% UD, Vorshlag camber plates, OEM 1LE Splitter w/APR Ext., Velossa BIG MOUTH Ram Air, CF QA1, ZLE brakes(F)

03-12-2018, 05:58 AM	#3
Boost Creep Drives: '18 1SS 1LE Join Date: Sep 2017 Location: Pennsyltucky Posts: 2,571	Probably didn't have the bolts in stock. I've seen TTY bolts reused many times and last +100,000 miles, never saw a failure. Doesn't mean it won't happen, but it's not something you see. I don't like the TTY concept as a whole, kind of an engineering example of "book smart, street stupid". It works in theory, but doesn't happen in reality. People are people. Imagine you're Joe Customer and come in for your $129 alignment and get a bill with $100 worth of TTY bolts added on top. Not happy. If every shop followed GM's TTY bolt replacement policy for every TTY bolt on every car since TTY's inception, the roads would be paved in discarded TTY bolts. Good luck finding a shop/dealer doing things "by the book".

03-12-2018, 08:45 AM	#5
Boost Creep Drives: '18 1SS 1LE Join Date: Sep 2017 Location: Pennsyltucky Posts: 2,571	Gotta earn the name Stealership somehow.

03-12-2018, 09:58 AM	#7
thescreensavers Drives: SW 1SS 1LE / Jeep XJ Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: WPB,FL Posts: 799	Check out this thread for more details http://www.camaro6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=502324 In my Experience alignment techs no matter how good, most do not follow OEM torque specs and likely are not "yielding" the bolt. Also this would explain alignment shifts after track events.

03-12-2018, 10:34 AM	#8
Mountain Drives: 2017 SS 1LE, 2016 1SS (previous) Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: Metro-Detroit Posts: 1,863	So, as I gather it, yes, TTY bolts should be replaced where necessary and able. But here's the thing [that a buddy of mine reminded me of], that I did not think of (and should have from my OEM days). At the plant, it is common for vehicles to undergo minor fixes, to which many times include adjusting parts or installing/updating certain parts that have TTY bolts. Usually, TTY bolts are NOT replaced in these situations... Should they be? Yes. Do I think you can get away with re-using some bolts? Yes... but, I wouldn't reuse them too much...

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