[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by clg82

Go drive your electric car........

Do you see one in my sig. If I did have one then trust me when I say it would be the fastest car in my fleet.

Even with E15 or whatever they decide on, it still changes nothing towards the fact that A - all cars will be required to have 40 MPGs by 2026 or something like that and B - no gas powered vehicles will be available for consumers in mass by 2035. So none of this even matters. At best it will keep prices kinda down which won't matter because gas prices will still be higher and will never return to what they were even a year ago.

[95 imp]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

At best it will keep prices kinda down which won't matter because gas prices will still be higher and will never return to what they were even a year ago.

Which is the modus operandi of Uncle Sam. They did this with freon (and are going to do it again with the "new" "safe for the ozone" refrigerants that they have now decided to phase out because they are "bad for global warming"), which is throw increasing taxes and mandate reduced production on a sliding scale until the phase out target date.

As the cost of the freon (or gasoline) climbs, they force you (economically) to do as they wish and call it a "free market solution".

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by 95 imp

Which is the modus operandi of Uncle Sam. They did this with freon (and are going to do it again with the "new" "safe for the ozone" refrigerants that they have now decided to phase out because they are "bad for global warming"), which is throw increasing taxes and mandate reduced production on a sliding scale until the phase out target date.

As the cost of the freon (or gasoline) climbs, they force you (economically) to do as they wish and call it a "free market solution".

I am soo glad that someone other than me can see this. Thank you.

[redcoats1976]

true.our democracy at work making millions of cars obsolete before their time.i dont guess it pollutes when they sit in junkyards waiting to be recycled.perhaps someone will find a way to convert them to hydrogen fuels and lessen the burden on our electric infrastructure instead of forcing mass adoption of electric cars.ironically we will still be burning coal to power these electric cars for a while,and electricity will probably go through the roof in price.ive not said anything about the politics involved here but its hard not to.

[ZED SLED]

Originally Posted by UnknownJinX

Do you possibly mean "tone" rather than "tune"?

I mean, there are still a lot of older cars on the road today that can't take E15 because ethanol is pretty corrosive. The change of concentration may or may not be an issue.

No, I meant tune.

[jamala00]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

Do you see one in my sig. If I did have one then trust me when I say it would be the fastest car in my fleet.

Even with E15 or whatever they decide on, it still changes nothing towards the fact that A - all cars will be required to have 40 MPGs by 2026 or something like that and B - no gas powered vehicles will be available for consumers in mass by 2035. So none of this even matters. At best it will keep prices kinda down which won't matter because gas prices will still be higher and will never return to what they were even a year ago.

That is not true. All cars must "average" 40 MPG by 2026. That is a big difference. For example for every X number of Prius's Toyota produces, they can produce X amount of Tundra's. I would also imagine since manufactures are now producing EV's which have unlimited "MPG", that would also factor into how many trucks or large SUVs they can produce.

[UnknownJinX]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

Do you see one in my sig. If I did have one then trust me when I say it would be the fastest car in my fleet.

Even with E15 or whatever they decide on, it still changes nothing towards the fact that A - all cars will be required to have 40 MPGs by 2026 or something like that and B - no gas powered vehicles will be available for consumers in mass by 2035. So none of this even matters. At best it will keep prices kinda down which won't matter because gas prices will still be higher and will never return to what they were even a year ago.

If you want to discuss EVs...

It's very hard to say, since batteries aren't going to realistically get any significant improvements. I personally think BEVs, (P)HEVs and ICEVs will live alongside each other for a good while. Maybe ICEVs will be phased out, but (P)HEVs, no.

The trouble with batteries is that it is not just hitting some technical bottlenecks(better, cheaper materials, etc.), it's starting to hit physical(breaks the laws of physics) bottlenecks.

Lithium batteries are as troublesome as they are when they fail. Basically when EVs catch fire, the current solution is to... Just wait it out. Now imagine bigger and more frequent fires with the higher energy density batteries. Just safety alone makes such a battery impractical since it is closer to a grenade than it is to a battery. One of the reasons why solid state batteries are eternally "five years away" is because the problem with stability, not to mention cost and other such things. Now Toyota is saying that they are going to make solid state batteries happen in their production cars, but if solid state batteries are happening in a practical form, I would expect a much bigger buzz from the tech world. I will believe it when I see it.

(Just in case someone asks, hydrocarbon fuels have high energy density, yes, but they require oxygen to really be able to do any damage. This makes them a lot more manageable than batteries where all you need to start a fire with is a short.)

FCEV is another idea but that has its own share of technical challenges, and since most hydrogen in the world is made from steam reformation of natural gas, the emission problems are still present, let alone the transportations and storage emissions.

Originally Posted by redcoats1976

true.our democracy at work making millions of cars obsolete before their time.i dont guess it pollutes when they sit in junkyards waiting to be recycled.perhaps someone will find a way to convert them to hydrogen fuels and lessen the burden on our electric infrastructure instead of forcing mass adoption of electric cars.ironically we will still be burning coal to power these electric cars for a while,and electricity will probably go through the roof in price.ive not said anything about the politics involved here but its hard not to.

Turning one element into another is called alchemy. We all know how well that works.

Sure, nuclear reaction turns one element into another, but I don't think you can make nuclear fuel out of steel, and then you still have to worry about the waste disposal.

Originally Posted by ZED SLED

No, I meant tune.

Well, running a car on ethanol fuel doesn't just require the right software, hardwares like fuel lines and pumps also need to be able to handle them. Ethanol is pretty harsh on seals.

Especially on older cars where things are past their prime, it could cause some leaks and subsequently, safety issues.

[Zr8000]

We have e15 here and have for a while. The price difference between e10 and E15 is about 4-5 bucks a fill up on my daily driver. Won’t save much of anything other than they can use it as a talking point to make people feel better. My camaro I run the non oxy 91 in it. It’s e free fuel they charge about a dollar more a gallon for vs e10 87.

[fielderLS3]

Textbook government solution. Make a show about solving a problem that you caused to begin with using a solution that solves nothing, but is likely to leave a long wake of unintended consequences that will hit those worst affected by the original problem the hardest.

[ZED SLED]

Originally Posted by UnknownJinX

Well, running a car on ethanol fuel doesn't just require the right software, hardwares like fuel lines and pumps also need to be able to handle them. Ethanol is pretty harsh on seals.

Especially on older cars where things are past their prime, it could cause some leaks and subsequently, safety issues.

Haha. I guess we're on different wavelengths here. I don't mean tune as in ECM tune. I meant the manufacturers might be saying something different now, hence, changing their tune.

[tall cool thing]

Crushin_LT1 it is the sign of the times.

[Chrome383Z]

Biden admin is giving something like 100mpg for every EV in the lineup regardless of how many are sold. I see a lot of halo EV in the cards…

Blaq is wrong, the average fuel economy has to be 40mpg. Throw in a few EV that the Uber rich can buy and you can keep selling 6.2L trucks all day long. They aren’t going away. Cars may be a different story….

[Expunge]

Originally Posted by fielderLS3

Textbook government solution. Make a show about solving a problem that you caused to begin with using a solution that solves nothing, but is likely to leave a long wake of unintended consequences that will hit those worst affected by the original problem the hardest.

Exactly.. and more ethanol is only going to exacerbate FOOD prices.. because you know.. fertilizer has not tripled in price due to world events.



Frigg'n idiots.

[UnknownJinX]

Originally Posted by Expunge

Exactly.. and more ethanol is only going to exacerbate FOOD prices.. because you know.. fertilizer has not tripled in price due to world events.



Frigg'n idiots.

Well, it is not a new problem to America. As long as the corn farmers have their lobbyists, there won't be any significant changes.

It's not like corn is also everyone's favourite food on the forum, either. The whole point is that there is way too much corn than there is demand for it as food, so they have to make fuel out of it.

https://youtu.be/F-yDKeya4SU