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Old 06-18-2013, 09:10 PM   #99
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...I owned a 2002 SS 35th Anniversary Camaro...the architecture underneath was twisty, bendy, and squirlely under WOT depending on the usual conditions. It would change lanes...it was stab and steer, just like the glory days. But...the departure from the lack of frame, body, and suspension instability from the factory was the LS1, a damn fine motor, and the electronics behind it. Turn key. All day long. The C5 Camaro setup is light years beyond it's distant cousin...and the ZL1 is the stuff of fantasy and science fiction in real life. Amazing what GM did and where we are today.
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Old 06-22-2013, 12:26 PM   #100
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The C7 can have a removable roof why can't the Camaro? Just doesn't make any sense.
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Old 06-23-2013, 07:25 AM   #101
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It makes all the sense in the world to a structural guy.

The Corvette has a completely different structural arrangement from the Camaro - it's a body on a separate frame, where the metal frame provides virtually all of the chassis strength and stiffness.

Camaros, Mustangs, Challengers, and virtually all other current cars are of unibody designs that count heavily on the roof structure for meeting chassis structural requirements. Convertibles on those chassis typically have additional bracing underneath to try to make up for come of that "loss" (and weigh a bit more overall partly because of this).


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Old 07-05-2013, 01:02 AM   #102
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those cars do not look good... any good vibes u have from em are prob due to nostalgia
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Old 07-05-2013, 02:24 AM   #103
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This thread is such a circle jerk. I know there are a lot of you with deep Camaro roots that like the 4th gen, but that catfish isn't respected by anyone else. It's ugly, the interior looks like garbage, it isn't a headturner at all, and the fastest one barely makes more horsepower than the current V6's, AND it handles like crap.

They did the right thing in making the new Z28 a Boss killer and making it a track focused car.
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Old 07-05-2013, 03:00 AM   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buckeyemike View Post
This thread is such a circle jerk. I know there are a lot of you with deep Camaro roots that like the 4th gen, but that catfish isn't respected by anyone else. It's ugly, the interior looks like garbage, it isn't a headturner at all, and the fastest one barely makes more horsepower than the current V6's, AND it handles like crap.

They did the right thing in making the new Z28 a Boss killer and making it a track focused car.
It may "barely" (20-30 isn't barely) make more HP bu it doesn't weigh as much as a locomotive like the 5th gen does.
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Old 07-05-2013, 06:22 AM   #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buckeyemike View Post
This thread is such a circle jerk. I know there are a lot of you with deep Camaro roots that like the 4th gen, but that catfish isn't respected by anyone else. It's ugly, the interior looks like garbage, it isn't a headturner at all, and the fastest one barely makes more horsepower than the current V6's, AND it handles like crap.
It is unrealistic to evaluate cars built when you were in grade school against today's "standards" (which I could say focus too much on appearances inside and out - and people still complain).

Nor do I see where your "handles like crap" comment is coming from, unless your own driving experience was in one with bad shocks and suspension bushings well past their prime. The earlier car having a different "feel" (mostly a stick axle vs IRS thing) does not necessarily mean that it's poor or grossly inferior. Just different. I've driven a 4th gen (Firebird, actually) a few times, quite possibly harder as far as cornering/handling is concerned than you've ever driven anything.

Rear-of-engine access, Optispark, and brake hop in some years, I'll give you as being 4th gen weaknesses.


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They did the right thing in making the new Z28 a Boss killer and making it a track focused car.
At least you got this part right. ( if you're old enough).


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Old 07-05-2013, 06:46 AM   #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buckeyemike View Post
This thread is such a circle jerk. I know there are a lot of you with deep Camaro roots that like the 4th gen, but that catfish isn't respected by anyone else. It's ugly, the interior looks like garbage, it isn't a headturner at all, and the fastest one barely makes more horsepower than the current V6's, AND it handles like crap.

They did the right thing in making the new Z28 a Boss killer and making it a track focused car.
I always feel guilty voicing this opinion in muscle car circles. 4th gens were just NOT where it was at for me. I've seen many that were absolute beasts but they never appealed to me at all. I always wanted older muscle cars when I was young.
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Old 07-05-2013, 07:04 AM   #107
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Someone say T-Top?!
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Old 07-05-2013, 08:05 AM   #108
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I'd take in a 98-02 for a garage project anytime.
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Old 07-05-2013, 08:22 AM   #109
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I don't think there is anything wrong with people not preferring 4th gens. I like Camaros of all years, but I'm not a big fan of the 1st or 2nd gens for instance. That doesn't mean I have disdain for them, though.

Further, as each new generation comes out, the previous generation (or two) starts getting a stigma. This has already happened with the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd gens. While I'm only 30, I still remember the tail end of people laughing at 2nd gens as being redneck rides. Now they're coveted.

3rd gens had this stigma while the 4th gens were new, but they're now becoming "popular" again. I say popular loosely, though, in the sense that more and more of them are being built with quality and those who dreamed of them when young can now buy/build mint examples.

What this means is now the 4th gens get the frowns. That's fine and all, but just remember, those of you who own 5th gens will get the same treatment in the future -- especially those with a V6.

Now, since a couple people want to sling mud about the 4th gen V8's having the same power as 5th gen V6's... I kind of like that you think that. But, because this is a Camaro site and I love all Camaros, it's important to note that your V6 lacks a LOT of torque compared to the LS1. Further, while numbers on paper showed the Camaro making 25hp less than the equivalent Corvette, it was in actuality like it is today -- a LS1 in a Camaro made the same power as a LS1 in a Corvette just as the LS3 in the Camaro makes the same power as the LS3 in the Corvette. Don't forget the significant weight difference.

I don't want to turn this into a pissing match, but it is important for the new Camaro "fans" to understand the true intricacies rather than simply infer things that aren't true. To be honest, a V6 4th gen would be a drivers race with a V6 5th gen. It's just the way it is as the tracks do not lie.
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Old 07-05-2013, 09:26 AM   #110
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I don't think there is anything wrong with people not preferring 4th gens. I like Camaros of all years, but I'm not a big fan of the 1st or 2nd gens for instance. That doesn't mean I have disdain for them, though.
This attitude, precisely.


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Old 07-05-2013, 10:05 AM   #111
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T tops are one of the coolest things, ever. I wish my 3rd gen had them, but im currently saving for a 2nd gen, and theres no way im buying one without T tops! I guess I don't get why they cant do t tops on the 5th gens, could anyone fill me in?
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Old 07-05-2013, 10:59 AM   #112
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Could be Chevy balked at the expense of developing and crash-certifying a third and distinctly different structural configuration, if they could not predict enough benefit in terms of additional sales.


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