[PolynesianPowerhouse]

Well the past few months, I've been trying something new. This is for myself and my own cars use fiest and foremost. If it offers insight to others, i dont mind sharing. Most do not have a rhyme nor reason in travelling 30-40k miles PER YEAR. i however do and care about longevity.

Theres a few local guys that are in the low 10's and 11's that pointed me in this direction and after a decent amount of reading, learning, and some help from a well known company, I've decided to install a catch can IN LINE to see how well my first one was performing, as well as adding an additional line for a continuous vacuum.

The main point of the continuous vacuum, is at low speed, deceleration, and idle, the PCV works as it should evacuating blowby from the crank case....

However, once the engine speed goes up, and for those of use who drive aggressive, drag race, autoX, or track their car... the PCV VALVE closes as it should. leaving those blowby fumes/vapors inside the crankcase until deceleration, lower speeds, or idle returns.

I've been told , that all I'm doing is "sucking liquids" and a lot of other unfounded accusations without any sources or proof. But now, we have visual and video proof of what exactly is being caught No bullsh*t and hearsay.

to start a while ago...about a year. I bought a mishimoto can, and rigged it to be inline with the PCV dirty line. Never touched the clean side line, and for the past year, it has done its job respectfully. every 5-10K i'd basically get 0.5 to 1 ounce of caught blowby.

I run BND Automotive Quantum Blue Custom Blended Oil. and have done so on the past 3 cars for well over a combined 330,000 miles over 3 cars. the 07 charger being the longest at 244,033 miles upon trade in. I also complete an oil sample analysis most every oil change through either Tribology or Blackstone. and the oil change suggestions have been extended most every time, as it still has useable life left. The most current oil sample analysis has been sent out and I can update the post with it when it comes back in, however the past year, I went through 3 of them so far. All wear and metals have been normal.

For the test, I kept the Mishimoto inline with the dirty PCV side and first inline. Second, I had added an Elite E2-X catch can with 3 ports. Two Exits and One Entry.

1) The center line is the dirty PCV line entry. with the setup the way it is, its using the MM can out line as the dirty line source.

2) the outer port towards the front of the can (front of car) is the out side of the can and goes back into the Venturi Valve on the intake of the car. NOTE: AT THIS POINT THE DIRTY SIDE PCV ROUTE IS COMPLETED. FROM EXIT AT REAR PCV VALVE, THROUGH THE CANS, AND INTO THE VENTURI VALVE

3) the last and outer port towards the rear of the can (rear of car), serves as the tap into the intake manifold and is the full time suction line, which is beneficial at all times, but majority higher rpms (when we drive, be it highway use, traffic, aggressive/sporty or at the track/autoX you're on the gas more than the brakes)


The clean side lines, which normally goes into the passenger side of the intake tube via the nipple....still does so. however evacuation of the front side bridge of clean lines is done so with the clean side separator (which has filtering media within it) and any oil vapors (since they aren't dirty) condense and drop back down the same spout you pour your oil.

Here is a progression of where each line starts and flows towards. Mind you, there's only "a lot of lines" because there are TWO functioning and working catch cans in series installed.

1) The Yellow line flows from the back of the engine to the Mishimoto Can (tried to do the color, but it was not visible)
2) Leaving the "Out" Port of the Mishimoto can, The Red lineflows into the "In Line of the Elite Engineering E2-X can.
3) The Lime Green line flows out of the E2-X and goes into the Venturi Valve
NOTE: AT THIS POINT THE DIRTY SIDE PCV ROUTE IS COMPLETED. FROM EXIT AT REAR PCV VALVE, THROUGH THE CANS, AND INTO THE VENTURI VALVE

4)Lastly The Blue line covers the clean side bridge. the T-section is capped, but both bridges are still open to flow. the flow occurs from left side cylinder head (pass side) to the right side cylinder head (driver side) and then up to the clean side separator, and then back to the left side of the intake manifold. the reason for this is the filtering media inside the CC separator allows any condensed and collected oil to drop back into the oil funnel spout, and the rest of the "clean side air" to go into the intake for combustion. So this still functions in the same manner as it did. it just has a filter media inline before it goes back into the intake port on the left side.




To start with the results:

This was the total collection in the 1st in line, Mishimoto Compact can. granted its a smaller can, It catches. This is after just over 4,000 miles. on a car that just rolled over 45K today getting some new "additions" after work and an errand.



Inside the can, you can see the grit/baked on part, which are the particles in the blowby that catch cans catch. this is what on a stock PCV system ends up getting stuck on the valves and cokes up intake valves. on the older 5th gen LFX engines...the amount of blowby caught was sometime triple to 4 times the amount in similar time frames. I ran an apex V2 can on the past car, and between 5-7K the can was near full and I believe the capacity was like 2 or 3 ounces. so yes, GM has improved their PCV system in the upgraded LGX system, but its not perfect. See This Post for a member who has posted what valves can look like in over time.

I picked these OXO Mini Measuring Cups because I thought they were oh so cute nah, but they did meet the minimum amount of fluid I figured I would have from the catch cans normal amount being caught.





Emptying the Mishimoto can gave me ALMOST a half ounce of fluid. the reason why I said fluid... is because all of this is def not oil (even though one claims the additional vacuum sucks oil from the crankcase). we know that when oil coats something, its thicker and tends to move slower, especially once cooled off. oil is thicker, simple as that. what is being caught is the blowby (all the harmful contaminants,hydrocarbon residues, fuel, and condensation that its vaporized once the oil reaches 212 degrees. a short video of the fluid being shaken. and it certainly didn't smell similar of the actual oil I just changed and took a sample of. nor was it thick as the oil sample. has more of a watery state to it and didn't adhere to the plastic cups in the same manner oil does. especially used oil.




After emptying the Mishimoto can, you can see the gunk that's left behind and what usually builds up on your valves OVER THE YEARS. This is what Seafoam, CRC DI Intake Valve Cleaner, etc have all been developed for, even the BG products most GM dealers use, to clean your intake valves on cars left neglected. The quality of the oil used is part of the solution, but if you can prevent this even reaching that valves and staying in a catch can, being caught.... no explanation needed. the best way to avoid cleaning something up is to never let it get there in the first place.





In the bottom of the measuring cup, you can see once its set still for a few minutes, the different tiers of blowby starts to separate (I believe sat was a 70 degree day). once again, this is minor in comparison to the LFX in the 5th gen. but this is what you DONT want going back and mixing into your oil.



an example of a boosted setup (ATS 2.0) from mishimotos website



you can see the lighter brown stuff is more prevalent. if you google "catch can blowby" there are more examples from mishimoto of tons of different tiers of blowby being caught.

Now with that being shown. Lets view what was getting by the mishimoto can and ending up in the Elite can. the Mishimoto collections are on the left (just under 1/2 ounce) and the Elite E2-X is on the right. just about 1/4 (once again slightly under) of an ounce was caught in the 4000 mile interval.






So far ive done another 400 miles including today since the oil change this past sat. Something else interesting to note, roughly speaking, I've been getting about the same amount in the catch can at each intereval I changed and posted about it, in previous posts over the forums:

http://www.camaro6.com/forums/showpo...1&postcount=90

So even AFTER ADDING a constant vacuum source, I'm still getting the same amount in the mishimoto can being caught. kinda kills the theory that an extra vacuum source is gonna force more liquid to be sucked into the can. it turns out its pretty much the same amount. Just more are the more harmful blowby/hydrocarbon deposits, which can be seen in the can and at the bottom of the measuring cup. the second can's only purpose has been to show what was actually getting by the first can (which if you look at the combined total of the two, its about 1/3 getting through). Once again, no engine is 100% efficient, and no can is 100% efficient. but the more it catches, obviously the better.

Actual testing, which is what I prefer and why I've taken the time to do so, will always show what's really going on.








If you're new to catch cans and stuff, this post gives you a simple basic explanation with pics. its from camaro5. I still had this saved from when I bought my 5th gen back in 2013.

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showpo...96&postcount=1

[Billabongi]

Do we have a specialized catch can for the LGX yet or is it all universal stuff still?

[cellsafemode]

What your test proves is that the additional vacuum line is bs since one of the following must be true.

A. The vacuum line tap doesn't result in additional crankcase gasses to pass through the can. Since oil vapor should be present in the air if it's not being properly ventilated as stated by the catch can manufacturers.

B. The stock system ventilates the crankcase perfectly adequately without the vacuum line even when intake suction is low. Leaving no additional oil vapor to catch.

Either way it shows no need for the additional vacuum despite these companies advertising that it's use increases crankcase ventilation and with more crankcase gasses comes more oil vapor so these more expensive cans capture more oil/water. Since oil is one of the denser liquids vaporized in the crankcase air, if it was being evacuated under the stock setup (or handled by the stock separator), then all the other dissolved compounds were as well.

Or are you now stating that magically the crankcase gasses contain less oil vapor but still all the other harmful volatile chemicals when under high throttle and so the additional vacuum applied during that time has no additional oil vapor to condense out of the gasses in the catch can? But still contains all these other volatile harmful chemicals, just not oil vapor.

I dont know, it's confusing trying to follow the justification you have for applying additional vacuum while simultaneously showing that it doesn't make a difference in how much crankcase gas seems to be passing through the cans while at the same time the manufacturer who you defend states the opposite.

It's always been my position that the stock setup is perfectly adequate at doing the job with a catch can being needed to supplement the internal separator in certain outlining situations that allow significant oil vapor to escape into the pcv tube to varying degrees. That the additional vacuum line if it resulted in more oil being captured (which i have always used to preface this statement) was doing so simply to capture more oil to justify the higher cost catch can and to convince others that they are needed when they otherwise would capture much less. Oil is an unintended byproduct of trying to suck the gasses from the crankcase to the intake, the less that makes it's way into the pcv system the better. So as long as it's not clogged up, the stock system will do that job. And your test seems to corroborate that. So, thanks for proving my point ...i guess?

[PolynesianPowerhouse]

Originally Posted by Billabongi

Do we have a specialized catch can for the LGX yet or is it all universal stuff still?

Elite engineering has an full LGX setup (http://www.eliteengineeringusa.com/camaro/), along with the tap to tap the manifold if you choose this route I believe, not 100% sure, so def call to verify. they have 2 port cans and 3 port cans, your choice. their E2 can is roughly 185, you can get a kit, which would prob be a bit more. their E2-X can is about 335 with the basics. but a specific kit is a bit more as well. they also offer a clean side separator kit that's 99$.

given the kit prices of the mishimoto setups, for the 2.0T Camaro being a dual can setup @ 400$ and the v8 which is a single can setup @ 195$ in comparison. the Elite stuff is right in the middle really. all depends on if you want AN lines and fittings, or stainless braided hoses, or check valves.


As of right now, they have been the only company that actually has a specific kit for the LGX engine. not just buying parts and rigging something up like I initially did (yea I can admit it). I'm taking all mounting brackets for a specific location, mounting bracket, instructions (with pics).

[PolynesianPowerhouse]

Originally Posted by cellsafemode

What your test proves is that the additional vacuum line is bs since one of the following must be true.

Wrong. I went a shorter distance overall, and still achieved the same amount of blowby.

A. The vacuum line tap doesn't result in additional crankcase gasses to pass through the can. Since oil vapor should be present in the air if it's not being properly ventilated as stated by the catch can manufacturers.

It overrides the actual PCV VALVE once its closed during higher engine RPMS. you never factor in the obvious reason for the PCV valve is that at some point in stock usage....it closes. how would one override the closing? vacuum.

B. The stock system ventilates the crankcase perfectly adequately without the vacuum line even when intake suction is low. Leaving no additional oil vapor to catch.

Incorrect. when the PCV Valve CLOSES when the engine is at higher rpms...Then what???? when you actually drive hard, and not just say you do.... the pcv valve closes. the additional vacuum keeps this from happening, and keeps the blowby going into the can. remember...blowby constantly occurs in any running engine.

Either way it shows no need for the additional vacuum despite these companies advertising that it's use increases crankcase ventilation and with more crankcase gasses comes more oil vapor so these more expensive cans capture more oil/water. Since oil is one of the denser liquids vaporized in the crankcase air, if it was being evacuated under the stock setup (or handled by the stock separator), then all the other dissolved compounds were as well.

Incorrect. please show proof or read above, where you only factored in:

The stock system ventilates the crankcase perfectly adequately without the vacuum line even when intake suction is low

and never factored in when the valve fully closes. or did you forget valves are there to open AND close?

Or are you now stating that magically the crankcase gasses contain less oil vapor but still all the other harmful volatile chemicals when under high throttle and so the additional vacuum applied during that time has no additional oil vapor to condense out of the gasses in the catch can? But still contains all these other volatile harmful chemicals, just not oil vapor.

Nothing is magic. everything happens for a rhyme or reason. its not rocket science, but still science. an action happens, and a reaction occurs.

Still contains the same amount, just more of the harmful agents being caught. Oil vapor will be there, but its not the only thing that's a part of blowby. Also, I clearly stated this was a 4000 mile interval. in the past I've gone longer with intervals. if you haven't paid attention and read fully what I've written, that's your fault and miscalculation. Not anyone else's. shows in the bottom of the first Mishimoto can pics. over the past year, the solids, which pretty much adhered heavier in the current pics, have never occurred to that degree. since its in the can, and visible. that means its not going back through my intake ports. that's a win. entire point of a catch can catching.

I dont know, it's confusing trying to follow the justification you have for applying additional vacuum while simultaneously showing that it doesn't make a difference in how much crankcase gas seems to be passing through the cans while at the same time the manufacturer who you defend states the opposite.

Its easy to be confused when you don't understand A, then try to attempt learning B, and then later figuring out C. that's why we learn addition, before multiplication, and then later on algebra and calculus in school. you generally need to understand the basics before you try and figure out the more compound.

Not really defending anyone. I don't have to. my posts are here to be informative. not to argue, and defend, and blah blah blah. I'll let that be your job as the cynic. I'll be the doer, along with MANY others who are trying to share info, to help decipher along the performance of this platform of vehicle. and you can be the cynic.

already addressed the justification for the additional vacuum. when the pcv valve closes... if you missed the first 2 or 3 times above. or check the previous post. its referenced there too... don't lapse thought that quick that the valve is there, and actually closes at higher rpms and speed. just pointing that out for the 3-5th time now.

It's always been my position that the stock setup is perfectly adequate at doing the job with a catch can being needed to supplement the internal separator in certain outlining situations that allow significant oil vapor to escape into the pcv tube to varying degrees. That the additional vacuum line if it resulted in more oil being captured (which i have always used to preface this statement) was doing so simply to capture more oil to justify the higher cost catch can and to convince others that they are needed when they otherwise would capture much less. Oil is an unintended byproduct of trying to suck the gasses from the crankcase to the intake, the less that makes it's way into the pcv system the better. So as long as it's not clogged up, the stock system will do that job. And your test seems to corroborate that. So, thanks for proving my point ...i guess?

higher cost??? are you just a cheap person? its cool if you are, once again. no judgement. cause this seems to be the root of you apprehensiveness... COST. Your denseness is starting to make sense. you either just wanna be cheap or just make it look like you've done something...but do nothing. or you just are intentionally making arguments based upon not seeing the forrest because of the trees.


Some Comparisons:

Catch cans back in the day used to be like 100$ for a full setup, 150$ can was hi-tech sh*t...atleast with a j-body. but as engines have gotten more complex and efficient, so have designs....and naturally avg costs have gone up as well. across the board on all makes and models.

mishimoto makes a catch can system SPECIFIC for the 2.0T cars, the LTG engine and it costs 408$ from Phastek http://www.phastekperformance.com/Mi...6-cam4-16s.htm RETAIL is 516$...

they also make a setup SPECIFIC for the V8 SS cars. http://www.phastekperformance.com/Mi...atch-can-1.htm That one costs 195$ retail is 199$. they don't offer a clean side separator, but it was available on the elite versions as an addonon the 5th gens.

the Elite E2 can is only 185$ http://www.eliteengineeringusa.com/e2-catch-can/ the hose and barbs can be sourced locally for under 20$ that anyone would need. so basically its about the cost of just the mishimoto v8 can. 200$ LESS than the LTG 2.0T setup.

the Elite E2-X is only 335$ http://www.eliteengineeringusa.com/e2-x-catch-cans/


Intakes cost 300-400$, exhausts cost over 500-600$. soooo you're showing/telling us with your rationale, that 200-400$ isn't worth the proven protection of your engines internals??? its basically a similar setup as was used on the LFX for starters.

Now Both me and you, initially utilized a stock universal mishimoto can, with no hoses...just a can and a barb. it wasn't a full kit. we spliced into the dirty size PCV initially and NEVER addressed the clean side lines at first. 100$ roughly for a universal can Mishimoto can. two would be 200$ that's not including one way check valves, braided hoses, etc... the prices can be way up there, I agree.

but just piecing together a kit, and getting ZERO results and then saying, oh it doesn't work, isn't the way to go. that's my opinion (and I can base that opinion with many others who's stuff actually works). In your shoes...I would question, why am I not getting ANYTHING in my can, cause if your pcv was working correctly. you'd have something by now. If you put your setup back to stock 100% in a few thousand miles you'd have residue in your TB at the least. a coating...something. but a bone dry can??? #Marinate #ThinkAboutIt


its been your position. which is basically an opinion. you've never showed proof, done any testing, or even had a catch can that caught anything if in fact you actually installed it correctly with proper tight fittings (not just looking like its together). its like being the guy that never was able to do a burnout because he never learned how to turn traction control off...

secondly, you're still stuck on caught oil. the stuff that was caught wasn't just oil. I clearly stated above the smell was nothing like the oil change I just did. even added a short video, I know kids don't like to read much so vines are the new thing. I kept it to 15 seconds or so.

not to mention the harder baked on stuff in the can, and the solids at the bottom of the blowby liquid... that's not ALL oil. more so byproducts of a mixture.

since you're still confused, you should visit the LAST LINK (<--just click...caveman simple easy) I included at the bottom of the original post. if that page doesn't make sense for you then its no use replying back. as far as I'm concerned elite has been doing catch cans for the Camaros since the 5th gen. dual and triple ports. JDP Racing endorses and uses them. they must be doing something right.

get away from your position of opinions, when actual facts are in front of you. or just keep doing what you think is best for YOU. those of us who race and can prove we actually run our cars hard, will do what's best for us. G'luck to ya.



P.s. I don't know about YOU, CellSafeMode. but I am actually HAPPY with my catchcan(s), their performance, and setup. Are you happy with yours?

[cellsafemode]

Originally Posted by PolynesianPowerhouse

Incorrect. when the PCV Valve CLOSES when the engine is at higher rpms...Then what???? when you actually drive hard, and not just say you do.... the pcv valve closes. the additional vacuum keeps this from happening, and keeps the blowby going into the can. remember...blowby constantly occurs in any running engine.



Incorrect. please show proof or read above, where you only factored in: and never factored in when the valve fully closes. or did you forget valves are there to open AND close?

Did you forget that the LGX doesn't have a pcv valve on the rear of the engine where the dirty side comes from? It only has valves on the clean side (one for each valve cover). The dirty side operates simply by intake vacuum. I have the shop manual and i went through the engine parts blowouts.

Nothing is magic. everything happens for a rhyme or reason. its not rocket science, but still science. an action happens, and a reaction occurs.

Still contains the same amount, just more of the harmful agents being caught. Oil vapor will be there, but its not the only thing that's a part of blowby. Also, I clearly stated this was a 4000 mile interval. in the past I've gone longer with intervals. if you haven't paid attention and read fully what I've written, that's your fault and miscalculation. Not anyone else's. shows in the bottom of the first Mishimoto can pics. over the past year, the solids, which pretty much adhered heavier in the current pics, have never occurred to that degree. since its in the can, and visible. that means its not going back through my intake ports. that's a win. entire point of a catch can catching.

You can't knit pick what you suck out in the pcv system. You can't say you're pulling in more crankcase gas and not also take out more oil vapor since the oil vapor should be fairly uniformly distributed in the air that's made it past the air/oil separator. So since you didn't pull out more oil vapor, either you didn't pull out more crankcase gasses or the setup without the additional vacuum line was pulling out all the necessary gasses on it's own.

As for your particulates, In my argument, the stuff in the oil stays in the oil and only volatile chemicals are passed into the intake. I then change the oil as it wears out. I think we differ here mostly. You think the ideal situation is your catch can filling up and mine is that nothing but cleanly combustable gasses get into the pcv system to begin with. A catch can being a necessary evil for when the system is underperforming.

Its easy to be confused when you don't understand A, then try to attempt learning B, and then later figuring out C. that's why we learn addition, before multiplication, and then later on algebra and calculus in school. you generally need to understand the basics before you try and figure out the more compound.

Nice troll.. but I'm not wrong. I don't tear your posts apart piece by piece because i can't. I dont because i'm lazy and dont care usually.

Not really defending anyone. I don't have to. my posts are here to be informative. not to argue, and defend, and blah blah blah. I'll let that be your job as the cynic. I'll be the doer, along with MANY others who are trying to share info, to help decipher along the performance of this platform of vehicle. and you can be the cynic.

Revisionist much? So my post that started your whole tirade was not cynical, did not imply anything about anyone else's experience, just referred specifically to my car and what seemed reasonable given it. Then who needs to post a second time in the thread as if not having oil in your pcv hose is a personal attack?

already addressed the justification for the additional vacuum. when the pcv valve closes... if you missed the first 2 or 3 times above. or check the previous post. its referenced there too... don't lapse thought that quick that the valve is there, and actually closes at higher rpms and speed. just pointing that out for the 3-5th time now.

I tend to ignore wrong things. It bothers me less. PCV valves are on the clean side only.
The dirty side PCV hose basically sits above the internal air oil separator. There's no valve of any kind there.

higher cost??? are you just a cheap person? its cool if you are, once again. no judgement. cause this seems to be the root of you apprehensiveness... COST. Your denseness is starting to make sense. you either just wanna be cheap or just make it look like you've done something...but do nothing. or you just are intentionally making arguments based upon not seeing the forrest because of the trees.

If you have a catch can for 100 bucks (basic mishimoto) that is doing X amount of oil catching and a 300 dollar (like eg an elite can) and they're performing the same exact function when you toss out the marketing nonsense. That's what i'm talking about with expense. But in general, i put a 300 dollar catch can in the same category as welding a metal version of a coolant overflow tank offering nothing but a very costly way to not have pink showing.

Some Comparisons:

Catch cans back in the day used to be like 100$ for a full setup, 150$ can was hi-tech sh*t...atleast with a j-body. but as engines have gotten more complex and efficient, so have designs....and naturally avg costs have gone up as well. across the board on all makes and models.

mishimoto makes a catch can system SPECIFIC for the 2.0T cars, the LTG engine and it costs 408$ from Phastek http://www.phastekperformance.com/Mi...6-cam4-16s.htm RETAIL is 516$...

I'd completely get your buy in to marketing spin if you think a catch can needs to advance in technology as engines do. Or that any of them are worth 500 bucks.

Catch cans themselves have evolved in complexity, but it has nothing to do with engines. Catch cans purpose has and will always be to create an environment that condenses liquids to be removed from the engine. That doesn't change change in regards to anything in the engine. It's not filled with special catalysts and materials that only attract specific molecules. It's a one size fits all mechanism. The only thing that changes depending on the engine is mounting and hookups. Or when companies want to "improve" how the PCV system functions.

You can get mishimoto cans for 100 bucks. That's about all i think really needs to be spent on this issue. Everything above is a waste.

[/B]they also make a setup SPECIFIC for the V8 SS cars. http://www.phastekperformance.com/Mi...atch-can-1.htm That one costs 195$ retail is 199$. they don't offer a clean side separator, but it was available on the elite versions as an addonon the 5th gens.

The clean side is really very clean. Why would anyone care if it's not offered? Have you actually gotten anything from the clean side? I have clear hoses on that side and they're still clear after a year.

the Elite E2 can is only 185$ http://www.eliteengineeringusa.com/e2-catch-can/ the hose and barbs can be sourced locally for under 20$ that anyone would need. so basically its about the cost of just the mishimoto v8 can. 200$ LESS than the LTG 2.0T setup.

the Elite E2-X is only 335$ http://www.eliteengineeringusa.com/e2-x-catch-cans/


Intakes cost 300-400$, exhausts cost over 500-600$. soooo you're showing/telling us with your rationale, that 200-400$ isn't worth the proven protection of your engines internals??? its basically a similar setup as was used on the LFX for starters.


Now Both me and you, initially utilized a stock universal mishimoto can, with no hoses...just a can and a barb. it wasn't a full kit. we spliced into the dirty size PCV initially and NEVER addressed the clean side lines at first. 100$ roughly for a universal can Mishimoto can. two would be 200$ that's not including one way check valves, braided hoses, etc... the prices can be way up there, I agree.

but just piecing together a kit, and getting ZERO results and then saying, oh it doesn't work, isn't the way to go. that's my opinion (and I can base that opinion with many others who's stuff actually works). In your shoes...I would question, why am I not getting ANYTHING in my can, cause if your pcv was working correctly. you'd have something by now. If you put your setup back to stock 100% in a few thousand miles you'd have residue in your TB at the least. a coating...something. but a bone dry can??? #Marinate #ThinkAboutIt

If i had the opposite results, i'd be using the same evidence to come to that conclusion that i'm using to come to my current one. I get that you think something is wrong on my car. But my car is actually behaving like it's supposed to and yours is the one that is spitting oil back into the intake. But i'm supposed to be the one with a problem? If we assume how much oil gets out into the pcv system is going to look like a bell curve then there's going to be some vehicles that are on the cleaner side and some on the much messier side. Why do you think that's not what is happening? I've never stated that my vehicle was the norm. Just that it's very easy that yours isn't either even with half a dozen examples out of however many lgx owners we have here.

its been your position. which is basically an opinion. you've never showed proof, done any testing, or even had a catch can that caught anything if in fact you actually installed it correctly with proper tight fittings (not just looking like its together). its like being the guy that never was able to do a burnout because he never learned how to turn traction control off...

Your proof is a dirty can. Mine is a clean can. That's it. I had thousands of miles on my car before i added the mishimoto. The intake was as bone dry then as it is now. And dont bother with the whole motor being new nonsense, we have pictures here of people with less than 4k on the clock having messy intakes. If it was put together with air leaks i'd see a decrease in soot at least since i did not have any oil to begin with. I still get my slightly dirty wipe of the can. So no, i dont see any issue with pcv gasses getting into the intake just as they were when stock. If i didn't see any oil in the intake before the catch cans, then i would certainly expect nothing to be caught in the can.

secondly, you're still stuck on caught oil. the stuff that was caught wasn't just oil. I clearly stated above the smell was nothing like the oil change I just did. even added a short video, I know kids don't like to read much so vines are the new thing. I kept it to 15 seconds or so.

not to mention the harder baked on stuff in the can, and the solids at the bottom of the blowby liquid... that's not ALL oil. more so byproducts of a mixture.

no, you're caught up on the word oil. I'm not actually picking out the compounds in a wet mess, it consists mostly of oil so it's being called oil. Oil, fuel, and water is what comes out of what we also just refer to as "oil vapor". Then as the additives in the oil break down you get various particulates that come with the oil. Fuel should evaporate away along with the water unless you have a whole lot of it, leaving you with some contaminated broken down oil.

The problem is in your test you come to the conclusion that the volume of stuff is the same with and without additional vacuum. Oil vapor concentration under engine load should be higher than at idle, so the additional vacuum while under load should pull even more oil vapor than normal out of the crank case and with that oil vapor would be your particulates but the oil would be there as well. You did not find that to be the case though. With the volume the same, the consistency differences would have to be unrelated.

since you're still confused, you should visit the LAST LINK (<--just click...caveman simple easy) I included at the bottom of the original post. if that page doesn't make sense for you then its no use replying back. as far as I'm concerned elite has been doing catch cans for the Camaros since the 5th gen. dual and triple ports. JDP Racing endorses and uses them. they must be doing something right.

It's hard to do it wrong. You're using metal to condense vapor in hot air to collect. The profit margin on these things have to be incredible. Unlike intakes (present generation offerings aside for the most part) the only part of catch cans that needs R&D from one car to the next is fitment. I'd be surprised if any of these companies had a scientist staffed who's sitting in front of a computer designing the angles and structure of the baffling system going into the next can. It's just someone throwing some maffles and a filter or at least mesh in a can and making it easy to empty and mount. You think that's worth 500 bucks? Everyone's gotta make money but I'm not going to pretend something is worth what the seller says it is.

get away from your position of opinions, when actual facts are in front of you. or just keep doing what you think is best for YOU. those of us who race and can prove we actually run our cars hard, will do what's best for us. G'luck to ya.

I think it's humorous how your evidence based on what you see in your car is somehow fact but what I see in my car is opinon. Or is it because you've taken your car to a track and put 3x the number of miles that is avg on it per year? Because if anything, that would further push your example as an edge case vs the norm. I've taken my car up over 130 "in mexico" and have a fuel avg that's in the teens for a full tank on normal work weeks. Means nothing as far as "evidence" goes with how a car is being driven but i'm very confident that barring actually tracking the car, it's being driven hard by the standards of how the vast majority of drivers will be experiencing.

P.s. I don't know about YOU, CellSafeMode. but I am actually HAPPY with my catchcan(s), their performance, and setup. Are you happy with yours?

Why wouldn't i be happy with my catch can? It's working perfectly. The only way I'd be upset with how they perform is if my intake was catching all the oil instead of the can. My intake is clean so they're doing their job. Even if that job isn't really necessary at this time.

[PolynesianPowerhouse]

on the pcv dirty tube, do a suck/blow test.

I'm not actually picking out the compounds in a wet mess, it consists mostly of oil so it's being called oil

going by the definition of blowby, that's not what it is. of course in the last post you made up your own definition, and admitted to it. blowby and oil are two separate things, even though at times they can mix. its in the composition.

I still get my slightly dirty wipe of the can

Previously, you stated it was bone dry. so which is it? if you're getting dirty swipes which would mean that's collection even of minimal sorts... but then saying its bone dry is zero collection. (is it bone dry after you clean it out?) i guess this is where you implied you were lying previously?

we have pictures here of people with less than 4k on the clock having messy intakes

ummm yea, i just posted a link to a guy with carbon collection on the valves in my original post after 4k miles.

The problem is in your test you come to the conclusion that the volume of stuff is the same with and without additional vacuum

over a shorter interval of time. 4k vs the normal 5-10k (clearly stated). This is what proves you don't read and leave out important details to support your case as usual.

I'd completely get your buy in to marketing spin if you think a catch can needs to advance in technology as engines do. Or that any of them are worth 500 bucks

who said you need to spend 500$ i clearly posted up a 185$ option. once again you read what you want. that must be the lazy.



So im gonna follow suit, with being lazy since you claim to know everything. And most is incorrect or you say something is one way, then say its the other. Not wasting my time reading the rest


i guess I'm a bit visual. reading is one thing, but also putting said read information into visual play for my own verification is how I work. you can read about something only so much before you have a need to try it and see for yourself AND KNOW, BE IT GOOD OR BAD, IF IT WORKS OR NOT. so far, you've just offered claims and opinions. Don't really have time for the back and forth with your admitted lazy effort (as in why should I continue to put effort to show you, when you aren't paying attention to begin with), in not fully reading things before you reply. you can reply if you want, but from this point, I wont be able to read it. Should have done it a post ago. G'luck with your car, sole!

[PolynesianPowerhouse]

Second round. After adding the GM Intake and getting things flashed, I wanted to keep the tests fair, so I left the original orientation of the catch cans the same way. this time the interval was only 3,099 miles. However the air flow and the flash of the MAF sensor read different and perform differently so its almost like starting over.

The results were similar, in ratio... but the amount has increased and the composition of the blowby has changed as well.




This time around the Mishimoto can caught just over 1 ounce in the 3,099 mile interval. theres been more drag racing (about 15 passes), since autoX and hpde's are closing down for the year. got to see Josh of HHP Racing, put "TopCat" (Hellcat Auto) into the 8's down at MIR recently, and we did two other visits, one to Captiol and another to MIR. the normal daily driving and 3 road trips for wrestling.

As Mentioned the volume caught has increased.

the mishimoto can pulled a bit over 1 ounce:



As you can see up close, the composition is def more pronounced:




The Elite E2-x has been catching what has gotten past the mishimoto so far. and this time around, it was around 1/2 ounce:



I put the stuff from the mishimoto can in a used Fiji water bottle, and showed the side by side:





you can clearly see up that the amount caught after switching intakes and the flash, doubled. its probably more the design of the intakes that's making the difference. when air flow changes, so does power, efficiency and everything else, which is why I opted to keep it original until I did about 3-4K on the new intake.


As of last weekend, I finally got past a death in the family, Christmas shopping, and was able to spend some more loot on the car, so I rearranged the setup to now have the PCV being caught by the E2-x FIRST and then see what the Mishimoto can catches second. I also have the full time vacuum on the Mishimoto can this time around as well. the open port in the E2-x can is simply capped off, so its functioning like a 2 port can.



To explain the routing in this layout:

1. (Yellow line) Out of the PCV dirty tube and into the E2-x can.

2. (Blue line) Leaving the E2-x and into the In Port on the Mishimoto can

3. (Light Green line) Out of the Mishimoto Can and into the Venturi Valve section

4. (Darker Green line) Tee'd off from the Mishimoto Exit line and into the full time vaccum of the manifold.




The clean side separator has been left the exact same.


Headed to the track this weekend again, so once I get 3-4k done in this configuration complete, I can look into tuning, the LSD diff swap, and adding the ported manifold I've been working on and get it flow tested. Wanted to finish the testing of the cans first and seeing which more effective and efficient before adding any variables to the mix (hence the reason I kept the line order after adding the GM Intake for an additional 3k).

Also got some info on a new V6, where the contents were sent to a centrifuge:

This is a sample drain from a new V6 and it was spun in a centrifuge and analysed. The contents are as follows: 70% acidic water, 23% raw fuel and other volatile compounds, and 7% is oil saturated with abrasive particulate matter.

Figure the tracks are closing in the next few weeks, so might as well get through it and add over the winter time.

To note, times have been within a few tenths of my personal best of 13.539 @ 106. have had a handful of 13.6's all else has been 13.7-13.8's on 87 octane. gonna run 93 tomorrow cause it seems even in stock form, a bit of timing is being pulled in addition to a smaller tire this year vs last year.

we'll see what happens. Been learning sooo much this year! 2018 should be awesome getting into DI tuning!

[PolynesianPowerhouse]

New Personal Best!

13.462 @ 103.55 backed by a 13.488 @ 103.76

Actually having traction problems & spinning

[Doug kj6aco]

PolynesianPowerhouse Thanks so much for your posts and doing your research I have 17,000 miles on my 2017 v6 since May and I want to keep it for a long time. I put a simple 2 port can on and it's bone dry. I will be adding what you have. Thanks again.

[Jason@JacFab]

Nice testing! Very in depth!

[CruzySS]

Nice info and testing. Catch cans are proven to catch and help keep the intake clean. For some reason people think they don't do anything. Wonder how many posts this thread will get?

[Dustya]

Polynesian, First and foremost man you deserve a round of applause.. Even if some people don't believe you ( cant understand why at this point ). The time you have taken to post here and provide PROVEN, Information to the v6 community is beyond appreciated.

Sometimes I feel like people need to take a step back and realize that people do not have to post here they do not have to provide their finding and share information.

You are one of the few I will read everything you write.

I had a basic understanding of catch cans but your information is perfect to read and understand without being to technical.

I personally thank you for your time you have taken to provide this information and just feel you should know its not going un-appreciated.

[AJL13]

Great write-up, complete with in-depth analysis and data. The analytics nerd in me loves this stuff.