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Old 05-01-2013, 04:30 PM   #659
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Originally Posted by Wizard1183 View Post
Maybe so... its quite possible they introduce it, but the camaro has til about 2020 and itll be put to death again. No redesign of 6th gen and def no 7th gen camaro. But then again? Will GM ride this pony til it dies? "it's better to burn out than to fade away" is what I see happening. GM rode it til its death in 2002. I dont see them wanting to do that again. I wish theyd have stopped with the 5th gen, then bring back the Chevelle SS.
I'd say they will go with the Camaro line for as long as they possibly can...at least for the 6thgen with the platform change....It's probably easier to morph an existing model line like this one than stop it altogether and introduce another different named car...

To me it's the only regular "Chevy"...(Can't count the Vette...lol) that has any affordable, sporty, sex-appeal...

I think they'll come out with as many variations of it as possible for as long as possible and see what sticks in the future....
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Old 05-01-2013, 09:51 PM   #660
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Originally Posted by Wizard1183 View Post
Maybe so... its quite possible they introduce it, but the camaro has til about 2020 and itll be put to death again. No redesign of 6th gen and def no 7th gen camaro. But then again? Will GM ride this pony til it dies? "it's better to burn out than to fade away" is what I see happening. GM rode it til its death in 2002. I dont see them wanting to do that again. I wish theyd have stopped with the 5th gen, then bring back the Chevelle SS.
What do you mean "No redesign of the 6th gen"?
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Old 05-01-2013, 10:08 PM   #661
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I associate American muscle as having minimum 8 cylinders and above. If I wanted a 4 banger, I would get a Evo or STI.
I wonder if you offended any former or current grand national owners .
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Old 05-01-2013, 10:19 PM   #662
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I personally don't understand why anyone would want a 6 cyl camaro.

Actually ... I'll go one step further ... I don't understand why anyone would want a stock V8 camaro either!



Kidding!

Actually I remember seeing a beautiful 68 or 69 camaro on a website once that someone had done up ... and from memory it had a skyline engine in it. I know it's not a 4cyl ... but it challenged my thinking at the time.

Then there is this amazing piece of engineering: http://www.dieselpowermag.com/features/chevy/1102dp_1969_cummins_powered_chevy_camaro/

Next thing their will be a hybrid or ... dare I say it ... an electric.

Oh well ... it's all good ... more gas for me to burn!
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Old 05-02-2013, 08:32 AM   #663
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What do you mean "No redesign of the 6th gen"?
I mean that they'll introduce a 6th gen camaro for a few yrs then discontinue it without redesign like they have done with the 2014 camaros to the 5th gen.

Theyre not going to capitalize on the camaro like they did in the past and run it into the ground. I see them discontinuing it all together before that happens again. It was a perfect time to bring them back, but how can you justify making a "muscle car" or pony car that will eventually lose its muscle again? You cant! Makes absolutely no sense to make a hybrid or electric or 4cyl camaro. That was never its intention. Its a high performance vehicle and high performance is on its way out again unless you will have the money to pay for it. I.e. Corvette, Porche, Audi.....

The LT1 will be installed as the primary engine of the 6th gen camaro V8. 450HP will be the maximum amount of HP the Camaro is likely to see and itll drop from there.
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Old 05-02-2013, 08:52 AM   #664
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I mean that they'll introduce a 6th gen camaro for a few yrs then discontinue it without redesign like they have done with the 2014 camaros to the 5th gen.

Theyre not going to capitalize on the camaro like they did in the past and run it into the ground. I see them discontinuing it all together before that happens again. It was a perfect time to bring them back, but how can you justify making a "muscle car" or pony car that will eventually lose its muscle again? You cant! Makes absolutely no sense to make a hybrid or electric or 4cyl camaro. That was never its intention. Its a high performance vehicle and high performance is on its way out again unless you will have the money to pay for it. I.e. Corvette, Porche, Audi.....

The LT1 will be installed as the primary engine of the 6th gen camaro V8. 450HP will be the maximum amount of HP the Camaro is likely to see and itll drop from there.
Not sure I'm following your logic. For every Camaro sold GM sales 10+ Cruze. They don't have to hit FE targets for every model they sale, just a corp. average. Sales of things like the Cruze, Sonic and Spark will support the demand for Camaros and Corvettes for some time to come. Technology keeps improving so I won't be suprised to see 35+ MPG V8 Camaros in the future that produce as much or more power than the current 5th Gen. If they sale 2 T-4 Camaros for each V8, and those are getting close to 40 MPG 10 years from now, then GM won't have a problem keeping the model alive.
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Old 05-02-2013, 09:18 AM   #665
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Not sure I'm following your logic. For every Camaro sold GM sales 10+ Cruze. They don't have to hit FE targets for every model they sale, just a corp. average. Sales of things like the Cruze, Sonic and Spark will support the demand for Camaros and Corvettes for some time to come. Technology keeps improving so I won't be suprised to see 35+ MPG V8 Camaros in the future that produce as much or more power than the current 5th Gen. If they sale 2 T-4 Camaros for each V8, and those are getting close to 40 MPG 10 years from now, then GM won't have a problem keeping the model alive.
Sorry, but if 450HP is the maximum HP on a 6th gen. You honestly think a 7th gen will start off with 500? Maybe.... just maybe, IF and a HUGE IF, they produce a 7th gen, it would NOT be NA. It would HAVE to be turbo/supercharged to get there. Id want the HP to be NA. Then if I choose, I can add boost. I just cant see the numbers getting higher when it will basically just be unrealistic for the average guy to go outand buy a high perfomance vehicle. Thats what its coming down to. The amount of SS Camaros on the road now? You wont see that in 10 yrs from now. High perfomance will be less and less. Inflation is making the prices of vehicles even more.You see the avg.salary keeping up with it? No it doesnt which is why youll see less and less of thoseon the road. A V8 camaro in 7 yrs regardless of whether or not it has a 6.2L or a 5.3L will cost MORE than it did today. Add a supercharger or turbo and the cost will go up. So then youll be paying $40k for a V8 camaro as the base price. Eventually itll be out of reach for the norm.

I just dont see the Camaro lasting very much longer. I could be wrong, but I dont want a "high performance" car thats 400HP unless you opt for the turbo or the S/C. Thats going back to how things used to be.
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Old 05-02-2013, 09:32 AM   #666
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Sorry, but if 450HP is the maximum HP on a 6th gen. You honestly think a 7th gen will start off with 500? Maybe.... just maybe, IF and a HUGE IF, they produce a 7th gen, it would NOT be NA. It would HAVE to be turbo/supercharged to get there. Id want the HP to be NA. Then if I choose, I can add boost. I just cant see the numbers getting higher when it will basically just be unrealistic for the average guy to go outand buy a high perfomance vehicle. Thats what its coming down to. The amount of SS Camaros on the road now? You wont see that in 10 yrs from now. High perfomance will be less and less. Inflation is making the prices of vehicles even more.You see the avg.salary keeping up with it? No it doesnt which is why youll see less and less of thoseon the road. A V8 camaro in 7 yrs regardless of whether or not it has a 6.2L or a 5.3L will cost MORE than it did today. Add a supercharger or turbo and the cost will go up. So then youll be paying $40k for a V8 camaro as the base price. Eventually itll be out of reach for the norm.

I just dont see the Camaro lasting very much longer. I could be wrong, but I dont want a "high performance" car thats 300HP unless you opt for the turbo or the S/C. Thats going back to how things used to be.
But if you go back and look at the price of the 1st Gen Camaros and correct for inflation, the 5th Gens with the same performance are just marginally more expensive. Yet, you get lot's of extras (i.e., air bags, a/c, sat. radio, etc...) for that extra money. Yes, we go through periods where costs go up faster than inflation, then times were they are less than inflation. It all comes out in the wash eventually.

As for the 500 HP, if GM actually develops a 10 speed transmission and reduces weight by 15%, then you may not need 500 HP to get the same performance out the same HP as the LT1 10-12 years from now.

If you don't like FI, then yes you will have a problem because all the car manufacturers are going that route. You can always go the crate engine route or just keep what you have. However, most people don't seem to be shying away from the smaller displacement, FI alternatives that are being offered now. Why would they shy away 10-12 years from now when the technology is more ubiquitous and reliable?
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Old 05-02-2013, 09:41 AM   #667
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But if you go back and look at the price of the 1st Gen Camaros and correct for inflation, the 5th Gens with the same performance are just marginally more expensive. Yet, you get lot's of extras (i.e., air bags, a/c, sat. radio, etc...) for that extra money. Yes, we go through periods where costs go up faster than inflation, then times were they are less than inflation. It all comes out in the wash eventually.

As for the 500 HP, if GM actually develops a 10 speed transmission and reduces weight by 15%, then you may not need 500 HP to get the same performance out the same HP as the LT1 10-12 years from now.

If you don't like FI, then yes you will have a problem because all the car manufacturers are going that route. You can always go the crate engine route or just keep what you have. However, most people don't seem to be shying away from the smaller displacement, FI alternatives that are being offered now. Why would they shy away 10-12 years from now when the technology is more ubiquitous and reliable?
Good points and I agree with you. But I wont be amazed at the technology engineered in 10 yrs time. Eventually with smaller displacement and same or more power, what youre referring to, equates to a ricer in american form. Not my thing. I guess everyone then they'll will have large fart pipes on their camaros.

On a serious note, the "muscle" and roar will be lost. Which is what some of us enjoy.
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Old 05-02-2013, 09:54 AM   #668
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Good points and I agree with you. But I wont be amazed at the technology engineered in 10 yrs time. Eventually with smaller displacement and same or more power, what youre referring to, equates to a ricer in american form. Not my thing. I guess everyone then they'll will have large fart pipes on their camaros.

On a serious note, the "muscle" and roar will be lost. Which is what some of us enjoy.
I don't know about the sound thing. I love how the Coyote engines sound and they are just 5L. I think a 4.6 L V8 with a supercharger would probably sound bada$$, too. Even with turbos it would probably sound good. I really don't see V8s going away in the N. American market anytime soon. There will just be other options to choose from.
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Old 05-07-2013, 06:43 AM   #669
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[QUOTE=Wizard1183;6495569]Sorry, but if 450HP is the maximum HP on a 6th gen. You honestly think a 7th gen will start off with 500? Maybe.... just maybe, IF and a HUGE IF, they produce a 7th gen, it would NOT be NA. It would HAVE to be turbo/supercharged to get there. Id want the HP to be NA. Then if I choose, I can add boost. I just cant see the numbers getting higher when it will basically just be unrealistic for the average guy to go outand buy a high perfomance vehicle. Thats what its coming down to. The amount of SS Camaros on the road now? You wont see that in 10 yrs from now. High perfomance will be less and less. Inflation is making the prices of vehicles even more.You see the avg.salary keeping up with it? No it doesnt which is why youll see less and less of thoseon the road. A V8 camaro in 7 yrs regardless of whether or not it has a 6.2L or a 5.3L will cost MORE than it did today. Add a supercharger or turbo and the cost will go up. So then youll be paying $40k for a V8 camaro as the base price. Eventually itll be out of reach for the norm.

I just dont see the Camaro lasting very much longer. I could be wrong, but I dont want a "high performance" car thats 300HP unless you opt for the turbo or the S/C. Thats going back to how things used to be.[/QUOTE


? What do you mean? The Z/28 is 500 HP right now. The SS has been 426 HP since 2010. You don't want a high performance car thats 300 HP unless it has a turbo or SC??! Go buy a 2009 mustang GT. We'll drive the NA 400+HP Camaros!
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Old 05-07-2013, 09:40 AM   #670
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[/QUOTE]? What do you mean? The Z/28 is 500 HP right now. The SS has been 426 HP since 2010. You don't want a high performance car thats 300 HP unless it has a turbo or SC??! Go buy a 2009 mustang GT. We'll drive the NA 400+HP Camaros![/QUOTE]


What? Where'd you see that in my post? What Im saying is I dont see 400+HP in NA engines in 10 yrs. I think itll be HP made with boost to get the numbers where we're at today with NA engines. A smaller discplacement with boost to get the numbers means youre HP level decreases. Right? Thats what I was saying.

I am willing to bet in 10 yrs there wont be a 400+HP NA engine for any average guy to go and buy. We'll see but I'll stand by my thoughts until proven otherwise with the way things seem to be headed.
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Old 05-07-2013, 11:12 PM   #671
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You said the part about not wanting a 300 HP NA engine in your previous post. It has been copied by me and Gretchen. You also said the Camaro was on its way out and that it would end with the 6th gen.

Do you want me to copy it and show you?

The Camaro is not going anywhere ( currently outselling Mustang and Challenger). The Next SS will have over 400 HP NA. The SS after that will also have 400+ HP -- and your 10 year doomsaying is pointless and based on nothing.
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Old 05-08-2013, 07:16 AM   #672
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You said the part about not wanting a 300 HP NA engine in your previous post. It has been copied by me and Gretchen. You also said the Camaro was on its way out and that it would end with the 6th gen.

Do you want me to copy it and show you?

The Camaro is not going anywhere ( currently outselling Mustang and Challenger). The Next SS will have over 400 HP NA. The SS after that will also have 400+ HP -- and your 10 year doomsaying is pointless and based on nothing.
Sorry for the mistake bro. I meant 400 HP I fixed it. Well, its very possible GM does EXACTLY what they did in 1973 until 2002 which was milk the cow dry selling camaros as high perfomance when figuratively they were high performance for their time but NOWHERE near 1967-1972. And I can tell you that 400HP NA V8 engines are slowly going to go away. This is not speculation. Its naive NOT to think they wont.
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