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-   -   Who wants to see another V6 engine in the 6th gen?? (http://www.camaro6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=277052)

KMPrenger 02-13-2013 10:12 PM

Who wants to see another V6 engine in the 6th gen??
 
Lots of talk about the possibility of a turbo 4 in the 6th gen (and I'm betting it will happen) and lots of talk about the new LT1.

There is not as much talk about a V6 engine. (not talking turbo V6 here...just N/A)

First off, let me say, that with a light enough Camaro...somewhere in the 3,300 lb range, a turbo 4 could be a great performer. Especially if they give it 300HP/300TQ or more power.

But with that said, I feel that there could be good space for a V6 in the lineup, and I really hope to see one for several reasons. The current LFX is rated at 323HP, and 278TQ. I don't see why with some tweaking in the 3.6, that can't be raised to somewhere around 330 - 340HP, and 280 - 290 TQ. Keep the gear ratio at the current 3.27, weight around 3,400lbs like the Cadillac ATS and you have yourself a V6 capable of running mid 5s to 60mph and mid to high 13s in the quarter mile. Not to mention, with the lighter weight, I don't see why 30+ mpg on the highway wouldn't be doable.

Lets take that a step further and say they give the car a 7 or 8 speed automatic. That should help performance further, as well as raise hwy MPGs well past the 30 mark. (offtopic, but I hope they keep the tapshift...yes I really enjoy it!)

If we don't see the LFX in the next gen, then I see a case for an engine similar to the new 4.3 going in the Silverado. One bonus about this engine, is the fact that it has cylinder de-activation. I'm betting in a light car, with the proper gears, that it could return some very pleasing MPGs on the highway. Mid to upper 30s easy. Hell, why would you even need a turbo 4 with efficency like that?? For truck duty, that engine is likely cammed and tuned for great torque, and decent horsepower. I'd guess 300+TQ and HP around the same levels. If tweaked for HP, instead of Torque, (similar to how the Ford 5.0 is for Mustang vs. the F150) it should be capable of fantastic numbers.

So here, in my opinion you have the perfect combination of power and efficency. I know to some, nothing less than V8 power will do, and I have no problems with that. But for me, I really love my modded V6. She runs strong. The only big issue I have with the 5th gen is the weight. Some days I drive my (modded) car and think "damn shes running good!" and at other times...I wish I had another 20 - 30 HP/TQ on tap, or about 300+ lbs less weight.

I have no real desire to move to an SS (although I do love that V8 rumble), and with the weight drop that should be coming, I'd buy a V6 all over again. It would be a fantastic car, and don't get me started on how well I think a nicely modded V6 would perform in a light weight Camaro.

So....what do you all think?

EDIT: When I said I see a case for an engine like the new 4.3 V6...I don't actually mean that exact engine. I meant something with the same kind of tech it has. LFX already has direct injection, and cam phasing, but not cylinder deactivation. I realize this is harder to do on a 60 degree engine whereas the 4.3 is a 90 degree engine, but it can be done, as Toyota does it in their Camary.

mikeyg36 02-13-2013 10:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KMPrenger (Post 6158277)
Lots of talk about the possibility of a turbo 4 in the 6th gen (and I'm betting it will happen) and lots of talk about the new LT1.

There is not as much talk about a V6 engine. (not talking turbo V6 here...just N/A)

First off, let me say, that with a light enough Camaro...somewhere in the 3,300 lb range, a turbo 4 could be a great performer. Especially if they give it 300HP/300TQ or more power.

But with that said, I feel that there could be good space for a V6 in the lineup, and I really hope to see one for several reasons. The current LFX is rated at 323HP, and 278TQ. I don't see why with some tweaking in the 3.6, that can't be raised to somewhere around 330 - 340HP, and 280 - 290 TQ. Keep the gear ratio at the current 3.27, weight around 3,400lbs like the Cadillac ATS and you have yourself a V6 capable of running mid 5s to 60mph and mid to high 13s in the quarter mile. Not to mention, with the lighter weight, I don't see why 30+ mpg on the highway wouldn't be doable.

Lets take that a step further and say they give the car a 7 or 8 speed automatic. That should help performance further, as well as raise hwy MPGs well past the 30 mark. (offtopic, but I hope they keep the tapshift...yes I really enjoy it!)

If we don't see the LFX in the next gen, then I see a case for an engine similar to the new 4.3 going in the Silverado. One bonus about this engine, is the fact that it has cylinder de-activation. I'm betting in a light car, with the proper gears, that it could return some very pleasing MPGs on the highway. Mid to upper 30s easy. Hell, why would you even need a turbo 4 with efficency like that?? For truck duty, that engine is likely cammed and tuned for great torque, and decent horsepower. I'd guess 300+TQ and HP around the same levels. If tweaked for HP, instead of Torque, (similar to how the Ford 5.0 is for Mustang vs. the F150) it should be capable of fantastic numbers.

So here, in my opinion you have the perfect combination of power and efficency. I know to some, nothing less than V8 power will do, and I have no problems with that. But for me, I really love my modded V6. She runs strong. The only big issue I have with the 5th gen is the weight. Some days I drive my (modded) car and think "damn shes running good!" and at other times...I wish I had another 20 - 30 HP/TQ on tap, or about 300+ lbs less weight.

I have no real desire to move to an SS (although I do love that V8 rumble), and with the weight drop that should be coming, I'd buy a V6 all over again. It would be a fantastic car, and don't get me started on how well I think a nicely modded V6 would perform in a light weight Camaro.

So....what do you all think?

Personally, I don't think we'll see a N/A V6 in the 6th gen. We definitely won't see the 4.3 in a Camaro.

midnighter 02-13-2013 10:49 PM

I hope they are all V6's because I am keeping my fifth gen' SS.

Alrighty Then 02-13-2013 11:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by midnighter (Post 6158411)
I hope they are all V6's because I am keeping my fifth gen' SS.

Ha, funny stuff.

FINALLYSATISFIED 02-14-2013 12:22 AM

I'm sure it'll happen if it's economically and financially sound for GM to make a V6 Camaro N/A. If it doesn't happen, then it doesn't.

As Chevrolet would say "Find New Roads"...

sspolo 02-14-2013 01:36 AM

I also don't see the need for 6 cylinder, but only if they offer a 4 cylinder turbo Camaro.
Most people that buy a 6 cylinder Camaro care about MPG and that the car offers 300+HP.(Looks play a major part)
So with a 4 cylinder car with turbo the MPG would be pretty high and performance would be similar or better than what the V6 offers at the moment.
One thing I would hate would be a 7 or 8 speed transmission since it would shift too much.

Trentin24 02-14-2013 01:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sspolo (Post 6158824)
I also don't see the need for 6 cylinder, but only if they offer a 4 cylinder turbo Camaro.
Most people that buy a 6 cylinder Camaro care about MPG and that the car offers 300+HP.(Looks play a major part)
So with a 4 cylinder car with turbo the MPG would be pretty high and performance would be similar or better than what the V6 offers at the moment.
One thing I would hate would be a 7 or 8 speed transmission since it would shift too much.

Agreed, cruising in 6th gear on the highway at 73 MPH my RPMs are at 2100, and it is still able to speed up decently while still in 6th. But with 7 or 8 gears it would feel a little gutless to me unless it dropped gears. Just my $0.02

ToolFan66 02-14-2013 04:54 AM

You guys are high!!




LOL!!

KMPrenger 02-14-2013 08:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sspolo (Post 6158824)
I also don't see the need for 6 cylinder, but only if they offer a 4 cylinder turbo Camaro.
Most people that buy a 6 cylinder Camaro care about MPG and that the car offers 300+HP.(Looks play a major part)
So with a 4 cylinder car with turbo the MPG would be pretty high and performance would be similar or better than what the V6 offers at the moment.
One thing I would hate would be a 7 or 8 speed transmission since it would shift too much.

I would tend to agree (power-wise) that if their turbo offers power in the 300+ range, then it may be difficult to justify a V6.

But if the turbo is not any more powerful than it is in the ATS and the Buick, then I think there is plenty of room for the V6 in the line up, as even a lighter camaro with T4 making 260hp/260-ishTQ wouldn't perform much, if any better than the current V6 does.

I think a 6 speed auto feels just right, but there is no denying that a 7 or 8 speed would increase performance in a straight line and increase MPGs. Just look at what the 8 speed in the charger did for the V6 car...amazing increase in performance. But I also like the tap-shift. I think that would be a LOT of tapping in an 8 speed car lol.

KMPrenger 02-14-2013 08:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikeyg36 (Post 6158379)
Personally, I don't think we'll see a N/A V6 in the 6th gen. We definitely won't see the 4.3 in a Camaro.

I don't see the 4.3 going in a Camaro either if I was a betting man, but the cylinder de-activation makes sense if they wanted to go for max MPGs and use this engine. The Honda Accord V6 does it, although that engine is not a 4.3

Maybe they will have another all new V6, or maybe they will just update the LFX. Either way, I hope to see a V6.

90503 02-14-2013 09:12 AM

Like I've been saying, the I-4 is the problem...We may lose the V-6 in the process....and take a step down in performance, but like I keep hearing, if you don't like it you don't have to buy it...lol...
...So much for the additional "harmless" I-4 "option"...

Trentin24 02-14-2013 11:51 AM

Would you buy this car if it was just a more expensive Honda accord? Yes it looks amazing. But I had a Honda accord and would not want that power back. I hate the idea of putting a 4 cylinder in it. American muscle is supposed to be American muscle, the V6 was even pushing it. They should keep the V8 and V6. No 4 cylinder, no one bought the camaro because of the great gas mileage did they? Buy a Prius.

KMPrenger 02-14-2013 12:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trentin24 (Post 6159876)
Would you buy this car if it was just a more expensive Honda accord? Yes it looks amazing. But I had a Honda accord and would not want that power back. I hate the idea of putting a 4 cylinder in it. American muscle is supposed to be American muscle, the V6 was even pushing it. They should keep the V8 and V6. No 4 cylinder, no one bought the camaro because of the great gas mileage did they? Buy a Prius.

Honda accord? I think not. Not to mention todays turbo 4s absolutely rape the car you had power-wise (unless your going to tell me it was also turbo'd) Anyways....moving on...

Lets try to keep the focus of this discussion on the V6 and not have it turn and decay into a discussion about the 4 cylinder. (that thread has gone way wayyyyyy off track)

Look in many ways I agree with your statement. Its American Muscle...lets throw as much horsepower at it as we can while still keeping it an affordable car.

But we know the car can't exist without a base engine option. The V6 is no slouch..it makes good power and I'm happy with mine, but this is a heavy car. In a lighter car, I'd take the V6 over and over again. Why? Because although I have a nice income, I have other priorities and other expensive hobbies and I'd rather not spend 35K on a car. A 330 - 350HP V6 in a 3,400lb car sounds perfect to me. Make it handle well and feel light on its feet and I'm in heaven.

Emig5m 02-14-2013 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KMPrenger (Post 6158277)
(offtopic, but I hope they keep the tapshift...yes I really enjoy it!)

Me too. I only drive using the tapshift. I wish there was a way to make tapshift the default operation so that I didn't have to put into M and then hit the tapshift. I wish you could use tapshift to go into reverse too!

I don't know about a 4cylinder, a little skeptical on that. Also, I might be the minority, but I actually like a heavier car. I like the current size and weight as it is. After walking away from a head on collision through a telephone pole without a scratch, I just feel safer in something heavier, heh.

v6sonoma 02-14-2013 01:35 PM

While I like the idea of the 4.3L going into a future Camaro I'm not sure they would. One of the things they stated during the launch of the new Silverado was that the reason they made the new 4.3L V6 was because they didn't want to be like their competitors and put an engine designed for cars into a truck. So I'm not sure they would flip it the other way. Of course if it could be adapted to better suit a performance application (which I'm sure it could because it shares most of it's parts with the V8's which will share basic design with the LT1) then it might be another way of extending the life of a powerful, fuel efficient V6 in an industry that is switching to FI 4cyl's.

It all goes along with "What is a Camaro?". A question Scott and the Camaro team pull their hair out on a daily basis trying to interpret. Times are changing and while GM has probably extended the life of the V8 for at least another generation yet younger buyers are more willing to explore alternatives that older buyers wouldn't even consider. I would expect to see an engine option from each 4, 6, and 8 cyl's. Depending on what sells best will determine what lives on year to year.

We'll see. :popcorn:

Trentin24 02-14-2013 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KMPrenger (Post 6159988)
Honda accord? I think not. Not to mention todays turbo 4s absolutely rape the car you had power-wise (unless your going to tell me it was also turbo'd) Anyways....moving on...

Lets try to keep the focus of this discussion on the V6 and not have it turn and decay into a discussion about the 4 cylinder. (that thread has gone way wayyyyyy off track)

A 4 cylinder sounds like a four cylinder, that's why I would not like one. You will never make a 4 cylinder sound like a 6, and never make a 6 sound like an 8.
They should keep the V6's because they are great performers and I believe they will make them even better in the future. No 4 banger Camaros.
Why don't we just wait and see what they do instead of just guessing? It just pisses people off talking about what could happen, look at the C7. GM knows what they are doing.

KMPrenger 02-14-2013 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trentin24 (Post 6160250)
Why don't we just wait and see what they do instead of just guessing? It just pisses people off talking about what could happen, look at the C7. GM knows what they are doing.

Well...If we alll went by that logic, then there is really no point of this entire section concerning the 6th gen. We are human...we are curious and naturally excited about the new "thing" coming along. We want to provide our thoughts and input, so here it is.

Besides, if GM Camaro team is REALLY listening, as they have said they are, and the Camaro disciples have said they are, and Scott (Fbodfather) says they are, then this is a great outlet to show them what we want.

90503 02-14-2013 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KMPrenger (Post 6160339)
Well...If we alll went by that logic, then there is really no point of this entire section concerning the 6th gen. We are human...we are curious and naturally excited about the new "thing" coming along. We want to provide our thoughts and input, so here it is.

Besides, if GM Camaro team is REALLY listening, as they have said they are, and the Camaro disciples have said they are, and Scott (Fbodfather) says they are, then this is a great outlet to show them what we want.

...Never seen a thread begging for an I-4, but that's what we're probably gonna get...Everybody wanted a lighter car, but not with a less powerful engine than what we have now....so yeah, they listen...lol

rock1962 02-14-2013 04:40 PM

I think the V6 will not dissappear from the camaro the LFX is a good fit for this car and they may even supercharge it at some point.

mikeSS 02-14-2013 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KMPrenger (Post 6160339)

Besides, if GM Camaro team is REALLY listening, as they have said they are, and the Camaro disciples have said they are, and Scott (Fbodfather) says they are, then this is a great outlet to show them what we want.

They are simply not listing because "we" make up for a small percent of camaro owners. Plus GM has teams of people who care figure out for the most part whats going to be a good idea and not.

also THEY KNOW the enthusiasts like the v8s and even v6s because thats also what a lot of the people working for GM also like. but most people buying camaros are not "true" car enthusiasts, and honestly a lot of them would buy a 4 banger camaro that gets great MPG.

In the end its all a business and it follows the corporate games. GM and most car manufacturers want people to feel they are being listened to. Although sure at times i would bet they try to listen, but most of the time they are going to do whats best for the company. (which makes sense)

on a side not, reading Fbodfather threads and post are so dam annoying................... because he writes like this....... lol

trademaster 02-14-2013 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trentin24 (Post 6159876)
Would you buy this car if it was just a more expensive Honda accord? Yes it looks amazing. But I had a Honda accord and would not want that power back. I hate the idea of putting a 4 cylinder in it. American muscle is supposed to be American muscle, the V6 was even pushing it. They should keep the V8 and V6. No 4 cylinder, no one bought the camaro because of the great gas mileage did they? Buy a Prius.

The Honda Accord comes with either an n/a 4 cylinder or an n/a v6. So, in fact an n/a v6 is more similar to the Accord than a turbo 4 cylinder would be. The v6 in the camaro is a fine engine indeed, but American muscle it is absolutely not. It would be cool to see a mid-tier forced induction 6 in the next gen. If the LT1 is 450hp and they offered a turbo 4 base engine, then maybe the tt 6 they have been working on around 370hp, that would be very cool.

Captain Awesome 02-14-2013 05:29 PM

The V6 is probably going to be the first thing to be killed off thanks to CAFE. The MPG requirements will be too high for a V6. They will install an I4 in place of the current V6, since it will be able to get closer to the MPG mandate than a V6.

They will need to get great MPG with the majority of the fleet because they will need extra MPG to offset the fuel guzzling ZL1 which will be the only V8 option available. In spite of the factthe ZL1 will be limited production and priced so only a select few will be able to get one, they will still need a lot of I4's to make up for it.

Trentin24 02-14-2013 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Captain Awesome (Post 6161084)
The V6 is probably going to be the first thing to be killed off thanks to CAFE. The MPG requirements will be too high for a V6. They will install an I4 in place of the current V6, since it will be able to get closer to the MPG mandate than a V6.

They will need to get great MPG with the majority of the fleet because they will need extra MPG to offset the fuel guzzling ZL1 which will be the only V8 option available. In spite of the factthe ZL1 will be limited production and priced so only a select few will be able to get one, they will still need a lot of I4's to make up for it.

If that's the case and they quit making the V6 I'll keep mine forever as a collectors item. It will have to be worth something in the future.

Captain Awesome 02-14-2013 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trentin24 (Post 6161297)
If that's the case and they quit making the V6 I'll keep mine forever as a collectors item. It will have to be worth something in the future.

All is not lost!

I suspect that eventually the I4 will be too much of a guzzler, so the camaro will get some kind of hybrid drivetrain with a V-twin or something and they will drop the V8 from the lineup and the ZL1 and Corvette will get a V6 with forced induction.

You will then be able to get a V6.

TooCool5 02-14-2013 08:52 PM

I'd like to see a Supercharged Direct Injection 3800 V6 as an option.
IMO one of the best engine built. :iono:


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