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-   -   GM please make high-end 6th Gen HARDER(ZL1, Z28, etc)for others to clone/copy.... (http://www.camaro6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=273317)

FINALLYSATISFIED 01-26-2013 02:12 PM

GM please make high-end 6th Gen HARDER(ZL1, Z28, etc)for others to clone/copy....
 
GM, just me personally but id take some consideration into making the ZL1, Z/28 models (or whatever high end model you deicde to go with) harder for others to make there LS/LT/SS into them. It may be impossible but owning several models I've never been the type to slap other models parts on it to make it a clone(unless it was produced that way from factory, i.e 1LE). It may be harder to manufacture but making it extremely difficult would deter others to clone.

Some may disagree but owning a ZL1 I've seen alot of cloning/copying going on as of lately, from the 1LE/ZL1 rims, to ZL1 conversion kits. It makes owning an actual ZL1 alittle less pleasing. I understand rims being easy to buy but making exterior changes to the body dramatically will make people think twice about doing major modifications. Simple bolt-on parts are what is making people do it, take that way, and that'll cure that issue. I understand you'll stay have the die hard cloners but giving them some speed bumps could be easy. Just like its hard for others to install the mylink Nav into older models the same could be done for other areas.

Just my thoughts and opinions. Thanks.

Thrillz 01-26-2013 02:41 PM

Its never going to happen imo. Clones,tribute cars or whatever you want to call them is all part of the hobby. Its never going to stop or go away any time soon. Just be glad you have an original.

SnoopyAce7 01-26-2013 02:43 PM

I haven't seen any ZL1s in Woodbridge, you should be fine.

UF4LIFE102SS 01-26-2013 03:12 PM

Don't think GM will be following your idea. They want $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ anyway they can get it! Only thing i used from a ZL1 is the front. GM should of started with that frontend from the beginning. Thats what a VIN# does.

DandDC09 01-26-2013 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FINALLYSATISFIED (Post 6085959)
GM, just me personally but id take some consideration into making the ZL1, Z/28 models (or whatever high end model you deicde to go with) harder for others to make there LS/LT/SS into them. It may be impossible but owning several models I've never been the type to slap other models parts on it to make it a clone(unless it was produced that way from factory, i.e 1LE). It may be harder to manufacture but making it extremely difficult would deter others to clone.

Some may disagree but owning a ZL1 I've seen alot of cloning/copying going on as of lately, from the 1LE/ZL1 rims, to ZL1 conversion kits. It makes owning an actual ZL1 alittle less pleasing. I understand rims being easy to buy but making exterior changes to the body dramatically will make people think twice about doing major modifications. Simple bolt-on parts are what is making people do it, take that way, and that'll cure that issue. I understand you'll stay have the die hard cloners but giving them some speed bumps could be easy. Just like its hard for others to install the mylink Nav into older models the same could be done for other areas.

Just my thoughts and opinions. Thanks.



No one is acting like they are what they're not! If someone was putting the badges on it too, then there could be some complaining... If they're dropping the motor into it too, then they've got too much money and time on their hands, when they could have just bought the ZL1! I have the ZL1 grill on my 2LT because its a better looking grill and I dont like the other aftermarket ones! so does that mean I should have put a different one on or get an overlay style because it hurts your feelings? i think not! Maybe GM should have put this grill in it to start! It's called options for the consumer and GM still makes the money from it, so why would they want too increase the cost of production to make a few people happier?

It's posts like this that cause animosity and should just be deleted!

Thanks GM For giving your customers options that still deals with Camaro and its market!

The_Blur 01-26-2013 03:29 PM

This is simply not going to happen. General Motors is a company known for producing cars for the masses. As a result, a lot of products will share components, and you've got to expect that 2 cars on the same frame are going to have a lot of interchangeable parts. Even if GM went to the added expense to design a front fascia that doesn't match up to the fenders, meaning new fenders for just another trim level, someone would find a way to make it work. Car bodies are mostly cosmetic, and enough grinding and welding will make a similar bumper that wasn't designed to go there fit.

Let's also consider the manufacturing costs and how that affects your cost as a customer. Are you willing to pay thousands of dollars for futile attempts to limit the transfer of a ZL1 bumper to a LS, or would you be satisfied in a GT500 that suddenly costs less? While some enthusiasts go wild over cloned cars, remember that the average buyer is looking for some combination of price and product. While a product like the Camaro SS is unique from the V6 and a lot of cars on the road, someone in a V6 is going to install that SS bumper. If it's not a direct fit, they'll make it fit anyway, even if GM makes that difficult.

You're asking for GM to make manufacturing these parts as difficult as possible when GM is in the business of streamlining manufacturing of the world's greatest cars. Let them invest in great engineering and design. If someone clones your car, consider it a compliment and move on.

MBS 01-26-2013 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The_Blur (Post 6086252)
This is simply not going to happen. General Motors is a company known for producing cars for the masses. As a result, a lot of products will share components, and you've got to expect that 2 cars on the same frame are going to have a lot of interchangeable parts. Even if GM went to the added expense to design a front fascia that doesn't match up to the fenders, meaning new fenders for just another trim level, someone would find a way to make it work. Car bodies are mostly cosmetic, and enough grinding and welding will make a similar bumper that wasn't designed to go there fit.

Let's also consider the manufacturing costs and how that affects your cost as a customer. Are you willing to pay thousands of dollars for futile attempts to limit the transfer of a ZL1 bumper to a LS, or would you be satisfied in a GT500 that suddenly costs less? While some enthusiasts go wild over cloned cars, remember that the average buyer is looking for some combination of price and product. While a product like the Camaro SS is unique from the V6 and a lot of cars on the road, someone in a V6 is going to install that SS bumper. If it's not a direct fit, they'll make it fit anyway, even if GM makes that difficult.

You're asking for GM to make manufacturing these parts as difficult as possible when GM is in the business of streamlining manufacturing of the world's greatest cars. Let them invest in great engineering and design. If someone clones your car, consider it a compliment and move on.

Nice post . The Camaro is made for the workin guy/gal. affordable, with power . been that way since they started . If he wants something nobody else has i would suggest going overseas and spending hundreds of thousands . :bow:

Thrillz 01-26-2013 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The_Blur (Post 6086252)
This is simply not going to happen. General Motors is a company known for producing cars for the masses. As a result, a lot of products will share components, and you've got to expect that 2 cars on the same frame are going to have a lot of interchangeable parts. Even if GM went to the added expense to design a front fascia that doesn't match up to the fenders, meaning new fenders for just another trim level, someone would find a way to make it work. Car bodies are mostly cosmetic, and enough grinding and welding will make a similar bumper that wasn't designed to go there fit.

Let's also consider the manufacturing costs and how that affects your cost as a customer. Are you willing to pay thousands of dollars for futile attempts to limit the transfer of a ZL1 bumper to a LS, or would you be satisfied in a GT500 that suddenly costs less? While some enthusiasts go wild over cloned cars, remember that the average buyer is looking for some combination of price and product. While a product like the Camaro SS is unique from the V6 and a lot of cars on the road, someone in a V6 is going to install that SS bumper. If it's not a direct fit, they'll make it fit anyway, even if GM makes that difficult.

You're asking for GM to make manufacturing these parts as difficult as possible when GM is in the business of streamlining manufacturing of the world's greatest cars. Let them invest in great engineering and design. If someone clones your car, consider it a compliment and move on.

:clap:

lexlueger 01-26-2013 04:05 PM

:facepalm: Clones have been around since the beginning of the muscle car era. It's not that serious...

Blk-Ice 01-26-2013 05:18 PM

I don't do the clone ish....I strive to make mine different from everyone else's and make it as fast as I can afford! At present I would blow the doors off of a ZL-1 on tha straight track....... and as for a road course, it's not all on the car, it mostly depends on the driver. With all that said.....pretty soon a ZL-1 will be like an Anus....everyone will have one...lol! J/K.....it's not that serious homey!

TJ91 01-26-2013 05:26 PM

Honestly man, theres always going to be clones, but mostly just front ends. Its the illusion the forum gives. I didnt go with a ZL1 bumper because I thought everyone would have it, but I havnt seen one in my area that has one. But I went with rideskinz and paid through the roof to make my car different.
I understand where your coming from, id be upset if everyone was making a car that looked like mine. But somewhere I think you overlooked is where GM kinda made it more general. I mean look at the 10 spoke wheels. Those have come up on practically every Gm model concept theyve made for shows. Now you can get them on the 1LE and the Vette.
At the end of the day your driving a Camaro, ZL1 or not, the parts will find its way to lower end models. This happens with any car regardless of style or make. Just find ways to make it more yours. Black it out here and there, add after burners, paint the calipers, led halos, I mean theres still a million ways you can make your ZL1 different.

mxkx250 01-26-2013 08:06 PM

I think that if they did something wide body like the Z Vettes would give it the distinction that would be hard to duplicate and would be nice looking too. Not a lot, like the aftermarket ones I have seen. Just subtle flares.

The IOM Ninja 01-26-2013 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mxkx250 (Post 6087220)
I think that if they did something wide body like the Z Vettes would give it the distinction that would be hard to duplicate and would be nice looking too. Not a lot, like the aftermarket ones I have seen. Just subtle flares.

I don't know what world you live in but the Widebody panels on the Corvette are not hard to install into a base Vette....

Goo 01-26-2013 09:01 PM

People do it to BMWs, Jeeps, Camaros, Mustangs, etc... Not really an issue unless you buy something when you think you are buying something else.

The real core of the issue is the feeling of being elite or in more cases the want of being elite.

If you really want to be elite, go buy a Fisker Karma or a Bugatti... :facepalm:

jameslk55 01-26-2013 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FINALLYSATISFIED (Post 6085959)
GM, just me personally but id take some consideration into making the ZL1, Z/28 models (or whatever high end model you deicde to go with) harder for others to make there LS/LT/SS into them. It may be impossible but owning several models I've never been the type to slap other models parts on it to make it a clone(unless it was produced that way from factory, i.e 1LE). It may be harder to manufacture but making it extremely difficult would deter others to clone.

Some may disagree but owning a ZL1 I've seen alot of cloning/copying going on as of lately, from the 1LE/ZL1 rims, to ZL1 conversion kits. It makes owning an actual ZL1 alittle less pleasing. I understand rims being easy to buy but making exterior changes to the body dramatically will make people think twice about doing major modifications. Simple bolt-on parts are what is making people do it, take that way, and that'll cure that issue. I understand you'll stay have the die hard cloners but giving them some speed bumps could be easy. Just like its hard for others to install the mylink Nav into older models the same could be done for other areas.

Just my thoughts and opinions. Thanks.

I appreciate the honest input from a ZL1 owner. I know what you mean. All ZL1 parts should require a VIN, provide proof of ownership, and core exchange if applicable.

mntgome1 01-26-2013 09:15 PM

:facepalm:

FINALLYSATISFIED 01-26-2013 09:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jameslk350 (Post 6087500)
I appreciate the honest input from a ZL1 owner. I know what you mean. All ZL1 parts should require a VIN, provide proof of ownership, and core exchange if applicable.

Thanks.

Don't get me wrong, alot of LS/LT/SS owners have gorgeous cars and can very do what they please with it. I wouldn't say, the ZL1 parts should require a VIN, but I just want GM to make them alittle more exclusive, to whatever the most powerful Camaro is for the 6th Gen. As of now, the ZL1 looks to be the most power 5th Gen, so they should make it alittle harder to replicate.

I remember Al being asked before the ZL1 was made into production if the front bumper could be bolted on the other previous models, and he said no. I'm certain they wanted people to stay true to there vehicle and shy away from people cloning.

214Chevelle 01-26-2013 09:28 PM

The only way to not clone/copy something is to not invent it. :thumbdown: Once something is invented and released to the public and another feels it's worth copying, they'll do just that. Especially if a product is selling like hot cakes, they want in on the action too. And as long as it doesn't use any Chevy logo's or copywritten names, like ZL1, it can and will be done. Now, to name something a 1LE/ZL1 is not the same as ZL1 because the "1LE" was added. I'm no expert, just my $.02. But, I agree with you, I hate copycats.

MR 45TH 01-26-2013 09:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FINALLYSATISFIED (Post 6085959)
GM, just me personally but id take some consideration into making the ZL1, Z/28 models (or whatever high end model you deicde to go with) harder for others to make there LS/LT/SS into them. It may be impossible but owning several models I've never been the type to slap other models parts on it to make it a clone(unless it was produced that way from factory, i.e 1LE). It may be harder to manufacture but making it extremely difficult would deter others to clone.

Some may disagree but owning a ZL1 I've seen alot of cloning/copying going on as of lately, from the 1LE/ZL1 rims, to ZL1 conversion kits. It makes owning an actual ZL1 alittle less pleasing. I understand rims being easy to buy but making exterior changes to the body dramatically will make people think twice about doing major modifications. Simple bolt-on parts are what is making people do it, take that way, and that'll cure that issue. I understand you'll stay have the die hard cloners but giving them some speed bumps could be easy. Just like its hard for others to install the mylink Nav into older models the same could be done for other areas.

Just my thoughts and opinions. Thanks.

LOL your kidding right....

jameslk55 01-26-2013 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FINALLYSATISFIED (Post 6087559)
Thanks.

Don't get me wrong, alot of LS/LT/SS owners have gorgeous cars and can very do what they please with it. I wouldn't say, the ZL1 parts should require a VIN, but I just want GM to make them alittle more exclusive, to whatever the most powerful Camaro is for the 6th Gen. As of now, the ZL1 looks to be the most power 5th Gen, so they should make it alittle harder to replicate.

I remember Al being asked before the ZL1 was made into production if the front bumper could be bolted on the other previous models, and he said no. I'm certain they wanted people to stay true to there vehicle and shy away from people cloning.

I wonder if he meant to say, "no... the ZL1 bumper lines will not match with the hood lines." :D

If GM wants people to try away from cloning, they should treat all the ZL1 exterior conversion parts like their hood insert. Other than that, you can't make the 'ZL1' exclusive if you don't restrict sales of its parts.

Nick S 01-26-2013 09:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FINALLYSATISFIED (Post 6087559)
Thanks.

Don't get me wrong, alot of LS/LT/SS owners have gorgeous cars and can very do what they please with it. I wouldn't say, the ZL1 parts should require a VIN, but I just want GM to make them alittle more exclusive, to whatever the most powerful Camaro is for the 6th Gen. As of now, the ZL1 looks to be the most power 5th Gen, so they should make it alittle harder to replicate.

I remember Al being asked before the ZL1 was made into production if the front bumper could be bolted on the other previous models, and he said no. I'm certain they wanted people to stay true to there vehicle and shy away from people cloning.

Well if you don't want people to borrow parts from a ZL1 for their non-ZL1 camaro then how about all ZL1 owners leave their cars completely stock the way GM made them. After all the ZL1 is limited production and is supposed to be unique right? Isn't that why you are wanting GM to make it so people cannot put ZL1 parts on a non-ZL1 camaro?

Let's look at the flip side of this. It can also really irritate the non-ZL1 owners to see the real ZL1's being modified by their owners and putting aftermarket wheels on them (when the Black ZL1 wheels are one of the most sought after wheel for the 5th gen right now), different hoods, ground effects etc... Afterall a lot of us non-ZL1 owners would kill to have a lot of the ZL1 parts that the ZL1 owners don't fully appreciate and then end up taking off their cars because they want their already unique car to be "their own".

So in the end who cares what parts people put on their cars. Just let people make their cars look how they want. As another person already said the only time it really matters is if you are buying something you think is a ZL1 but it's not.

I feel like the ZL1 owers that are complaining about the ZL1 part modding being done to SS's and LT's is because they feel like their "status" is being pulled down since "lower status" camaros can easily borrow parts to look like the "higher status" car. It's just silly.
This "status" attitude is the same attitude that the Vette guys have with Camaro. They get upset when the Camaro get's too many vette parts or when their beloved C7 corvette has tail lights that somewhat resemble Camaro tail lights. Just silly. Mass production is that. The higher the volumes the cheaper the part prices which equals larger profit margins.

camarograna2 01-26-2013 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goo (Post 6087471)
People do it to BMWs, Jeeps, Camaros, Mustangs, etc... Not really an issue unless you buy something when you think you are buying something else.

The real core of the issue is the feeling of being elite or in more cases the want of being elite.

If you really want to be elite, go buy a Fisker Karma or a Bugatti... :facepalm:

Bingo... Well said!

camarograna2 01-26-2013 09:49 PM

:sm0:
Quote:

Originally Posted by jameslk350 (Post 6087500)
I appreciate the honest input from a ZL1 owner. I know what you mean. All ZL1 parts should require a VIN, provide proof of ownership, and core exchange if applicable.


wullger 01-26-2013 10:16 PM

You wouldn't have the ZL1 at all if all of us from 2009-2012 hadn't bought a TON of LS, LT, and SS models ;)

You're not going to get exclusivity out of a mass-produced car, plain and simple.

monstertodd 01-26-2013 11:19 PM

If you're looking for an exclusive car, you're buying the wrong brand.


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